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Mojomoe
Commander
Joined: 10 Apr 2010
Posts: 442
Location: Seattle, WA
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 Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 11:55 am Post subject: FFG Talent Trees |
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Howdy folks!
To start with, I know what I'm proposing is sacrelige/impossible/unwise/nonsensical, so don't worry about that. I'm not thinking about whether it SHOULD be done, but rather about how it COULD be done. Consider it a thought exercise 
My group of 20 years has leveled off their longstanding characters, and are running out of areas for growth. I'm considering letting them work their way up the FFG Edge of the Empire talent trees, and simply converting those functions to D6. The reason? While a lot of them are mechanical in nature, many of the talents are also roleplay-focused, and it occurs to me that my fellas might try some new things if they had new options open to them.
Here's the listing:
http://beggingforxp.com/2014/star-wars-talent-sheets/
My question is, how would people handle that scenario? Simply give them the converted (or best-guess cpnverted) talents at the listed cost of xp (=CP)? Only allow them the roleplay-specific skills and avoid the mechanic-specific skills? Allow them to multi-spec? Focus on single-spec?
My idea here is that these represent an interesting max-level specialization tree for characters that have long since stopped re-speccing their characters.
Thoughts? |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:22 pm Post subject: |
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This actually dovetails somewhat with what I was thinking about here. IMO, what you have here would be best used if integrated into character advancement from the beginning, with the difficulty of attaining the next step in the talent tree increasing along with the difficulty of increasing skills. However, adding it in after the fact to add spice to a campaign should function well enough.
Personally, I think it has a lot of potential if done right. A properly applied talent tree would give the non-FS characters some parity with FS characters, insofar as giving them their own "powers" to choose from. Not everyone will agree, of course...
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
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Mojomoe
Commander
Joined: 10 Apr 2010
Posts: 442
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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So would people like to see these trees converted over?
You mention in the other thread that you don't like the idea of Feats being applied to D6, yet this is a little different. Could you explain how, so that I could get a better idea for how to convert these? Are these talents somehow a better application for D6 than the D20 Feat system?
Also, how do you feel about the listed costs in CPs. Too much/too little?
Im interested in a good, solid system for achieving these Talents.
Has anyone else done any work in converting talents over? I feel like I should have seen this by now. |
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Pel
Line Captain
Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 983
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 8:34 pm Post subject: Re: FFG Talent Trees |
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| Mojomoe wrote: | | My group of 20 years has leveled off their longstanding characters, and are running out of areas for growth. |
Unless they all have 12D in Beastriding and Scholar: Umgullian Blob Racing Champions, then I believe there's still room for improvement. 
Can't say as we ever tried porting D20 feats and such into D6. I borrowed some initiative and damage mechanics from Shadowrun some years back, but that's about it. Still, I'm open to the concept. Show us what you've got!
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 9:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Mojomoe wrote: | | So would people like to see these trees converted over? |
I'm in.
| Quote: | | You mention in the other thread that you don't like the idea of Feats being applied to D6, yet this is a little different. Could you explain how, so that I could get a better idea for how to convert these? Are these talents somehow a better application for D6 than the D20 Feat system? |
My two main objections to the Feat system were how disorganized and unstructured it was, and that they kept adding new Feats every time they came out with a new book (this is way more noticeable in the D&D books, but still applies to the Star Wars books).
| Quote: | Also, how do you feel about the listed costs in CPs. Too much/too little?
Im interested in a good, solid system for achieving these Talents. |
My ideal version would tie Talent Tree progression to skill progression, much like how FS characters picked up Force Powers as they improved their Force skills. The main reason I would include a system like this would be to achieve greater parity between Jedi and non-Jedi characters, in that, under this system, pilots, bounty hunters, smugglers and such would now have "powers" of their own to choose from as they advance. Since Jedi can also pay a CP cost to learn new Force Powers independent of increasing Force skill level, a Talent Tree system would ideally have two methods of advancement; it advances as you improve a relevant skill or you can pay CP just to advance without skill improvement.
| Quote: | | Has anyone else done any work in converting talents over? I feel like I should have seen this by now. |
The closest I've seen is the Advantage / Disadvantage system in D6 Space (and REUP, IIRC)..
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10300
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 12:29 am Post subject: Re: FFG Talent Trees |
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| Mojomoe wrote: | ...My group of 20 years has leveled off their longstanding characters, and are running out of areas for growth...
Thoughts? |
I'm in the 'feats are an abomination for D6' category, but I'm not a naysayer so I'm not going to say "don't" or "you shouldn't". If you want to convert feats for your D6 game, collaborate on the work with others here and share the results, then go for it.
As just as another option of addressing the issue of the characters having no where to grow, has your group considered just starting over with brand new characters for a new campaign? Maybe even setting up the new campaign while finishing up the current one? It would be fair to mention here that, in my experience, the only players that enjoy playing ultra-powerful characters are power gamers, and as a GM I admit I just don't understand that roleplaying mentality. Most players I have experience with wouldn't want to play the same character for 20 years, so as roleplayers they would want to move on to playing different characters anyway.
The way I feel about non-species-related optional character abilities are that I only see a need for the ones that game-mechanically do something that can't be duplicated by raising skills. And non-mechanical roleplaying/story factors don't need any system to govern them. So my Advantages list is very short. I guess I can say that if you come up with something that could possibly be used as an Advantage meeting my stated criteria, I may be interested in seeing it and possibly inspired to use it in some way. And the non-mechanical stuff could possibly be inspirational in some ways for character concepts.
Anyway, good luck with your project.
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Mojomoe
Commander
Joined: 10 Apr 2010
Posts: 442
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 10:24 am Post subject: |
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You bring up good points.
The upside of having played for 20 years is that the characters have a rich history, and longstanding relationships. It's very much their heroes' journey, and as they all picked (relatively) young actors for their characters it's very immersive to be able to see those actors today and envision how their characters have grown.
The thing that interests me about the Talents (not so much the Feats), is less the mechanics and more the seeds of new personality growth. For example, my guys usually resolve their situations in much the same way every time, as their characters are well-established. A new Talent like, say, Don't Shoot or Smooth Tongue might get them to think, hey, maybe I should try schmoozing my way out of combat? Or the Commanding Presence one for capital ship commanders - maybe my guys will suddenly realize a burning desire to lead large numbers of troops. There's something about seeing a small stat bonus attached to a new personality trait that makes you want to experiment and grow. It's like breadcrumbs for character growth.
If I were to offer a small critique of the admittedly awesome D6 system that I've been playing since 1995 (!), it would be that the super-open "you can do anything if you try" dice pool mechanic, while far more freeing than the limited D20 system, sometimes sets into "possibility fatigue." Since you CAN do ANYTHING, after a while you just settle into what you know you can do well and forget the myriad other options. There's soemthing about having a limited number of options in front of you that encourages you to try new things. |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 1:55 am Post subject: |
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Hey, Mojomoe, I had a brainstorm as part of a discussion on another topic. Rather than taking the Talent Trees onto existing skills, perhaps you could convert them into Advanced Skills, with the special abilities coming into play as the characters increase their skill level on the Advanced skill...
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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