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Naaman
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 Posted: Fri May 15, 2020 11:42 pm Post subject: |
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| MrNexx wrote: | | Well, does any canon armor have a penalty that's greater than 1D? You're saying it should never be bigger than 2 pips, but that's right next door to 1D, and the only stuff that gets 1D is the full body suit, stormtrooper style armor. There's a few that are higher, but they're pretty rare. |
Isn't stormtrooper armor -2D to dexterity? This may vary from one source to another...
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Fri May 15, 2020 11:57 pm Post subject: |
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Every sourcebook I've got says -1D. The only 2D in there is the protection from Physical damage.
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
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garhkal
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| Posted: Sat May 16, 2020 1:30 am Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | Every sourcebook I've got says -1D. The only 2D in there is the protection from Physical damage. |
Standard trooper armor (whether reg stormie, sand trooper, snow trooper) is -1d. IIRC Zero g trooper is -3d.. I don't know of any core armors, that are -2d.
| Naaman wrote: | | cheshire wrote: | | Funny, the more we're talking about this and thinking of the challenges it would pose in terms of added bulk and weight, it seems to me that if I were to make alterations, I might impose a penalty to STR skills, (though obviously not to damage resistance). It seems like it's harder to swim, the armor would take a toll on stanima, would make it harder to do running/jumping. Brawling might be the only exception. |
I tend to disagree that brawling should be exempted.
Depending on how you envision brawling, but try to imagine Jet Li or Donny Yen fighting in armor bulky enough to encumber movement.
Roundhouse kicks, rapid punch combos, complex grabs and throws, etc... |
As someone who served, i can tell you it was MUCH harder to do hand to hand training wearing the vests we had, even without plates in, than it was without them on.. So i would say brawling should also be penalized..
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Fri May 07, 2021 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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I can almost see an argument here for moving Running under Strength. Yeah, most runners aren't built like bodybuilders, but the same could be said for swimmers, high-jumpers and rock climbers...
If one were to go that route for the portfolio of Strength, it'd be a lot easier to say that wearing armor penalizes Strength skills...
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garhkal
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| Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 2:29 am Post subject: |
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The runnning itself shouldn't but stamina should!
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Mamatried
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| Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 7:31 am Post subject: |
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Here is my issue with most skill penalties.
lets take the US army as an example, the soliders*s carried gear incluse a body armor.
In the case of SWD& this is not a stormtrooper type armor but more a blast vest type,
Now what skills doe wearing that actually lessen for the soldier?
the clsest we can compare a stomtrooper type armor with anything rel it will be a suit of full plate armor.
this is an exaple in how mux of their des\xterity they "loose"
close to 2:20 mins so a short clip of soldiers running obstacle course in full plate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAzI1UvlQqw
now where I think there should be penalties and severe ones is on "stolen" armors, espcially military ones.
the inside of a stormtrooper hellmet is not "glass" and see through, but small eye nodes you use, these programmed to the wearer (accorifn to read up on tech)
this would make it hard to put on a helemt and have any benefir before re programming
but all in all, lets look to out world and body armor, what body armor lessens what skills signifcantly?
is the USMC rifleman really significantly less of a shot when he puts his gear on?
....or maybe the penalties should be completely reworked.
I can not see a reason what so ever to have anything byt maybe movenent penalties for any armors, but a complete and severe "no use" penalty for many and most face covering helmets. |
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Naaman
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| Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 3:32 pm Post subject: |
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There are "ways" of shooting and fighting that take armor into account. I cannot speak to melee combat, but for shooting, the techniques used for shooting in armor work equally well when not armored. But the reverse is not true. "Old school" pocket-of-the-shoulder shooting doesn't work well with armor.
If you want a house rule to simulate this, it seems to me that a familiarization/training period could be enforced amd then the dex penalties go away.
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MrNexx
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| Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 3:59 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | I can almost see an argument here for moving Running under Strength. Yeah, most runners aren't built like bodybuilders, but the same could be said for swimmers, high-jumpers and rock climbers...
If one were to go that route for the portfolio of Strength, it'd be a lot easier to say that wearing armor penalizes Strength skills... |
Or, really, just making a list of skills the armor interferes with. Instead of "All Dex Skills", say -1D to Running, Climbing/Jumping, and Sneaking.
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garhkal
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| Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 4:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Naaman wrote: | There are "ways" of shooting and fighting that take armor into account. I cannot speak to melee combat, but for shooting, the techniques used for shooting in armor work equally well when not armored. But the reverse is not true. "Old school" pocket-of-the-shoulder shooting doesn't work well with armor.
If you want a house rule to simulate this, it seems to me that a familiarization/training period could be enforced amd then the dex penalties go away. |
The sparks group has a rule, where you CAN Buy off the armor dex penalty, over time. For a 1d penalty, it would take three sessions, at 4cp, 4cp, and 4cp (3cp per pip, per d, +1) to buy it off. So if you had a 2d penalty armor, it would be 5cp, 5cp, 5cp, THEN 4cp, 4cp, 4cp.
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | The sparks group has a rule, where you CAN Buy off the armor dex penalty, over time. For a 1d penalty, it would take three sessions, at 4cp, 4cp, and 4cp (3cp per pip, per d, +1) to buy it off. So if you had a 2d penalty armor, it would be 5cp, 5cp, 5cp, THEN 4cp, 4cp, 4cp. |
Considering how broad a scope most skills cover, it would make sense to allow characters to spend CP to buy a general armor proficiency over time. However, I'm wondering if it should cover everything. Armor familiarity would certainly be appropriate to learning how to "work with" armor when you're wearing it, but it never gets any lighter, so offsetting a penalty to Stamina would be better served by improving the Stamina skill.
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 7:36 pm Post subject: |
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| MrNexx wrote: | | Or, really, just making a list of skills the armor interferes with. Instead of "All Dex Skills", say -1D to Running, Climbing/Jumping, and Sneaking. |
Based on the discussion here, I'd say it's a bit more than just those three. A better summary would be "All Movement and Dexterity skills", then allow characters to spend CP to but armor familiarity and roll off the Dexterity penalties while retaining the Movement ones (like I said to g, the armor doesn't get any lighter).
BTW, you're one post away from a promotion! Make it a good one.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
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MrNexx
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| Posted: Sun May 09, 2021 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | MrNexx wrote: | | Or, really, just making a list of skills the armor interferes with. Instead of "All Dex Skills", say -1D to Running, Climbing/Jumping, and Sneaking. |
Based on the discussion here, I'd say it's a bit more than just those three. A better summary would be "All Movement and Dexterity skills", then allow characters to spend CP to but armor familiarity and roll off the Dexterity penalties while retaining the Movement ones (like I said to g, the armor doesn't get any lighter).
BTW, you're one post away from a promotion! Make it a good one. |
I absolutely refuse to do that. 
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