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Defense against the Force - Willpower skill?
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Whill
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Joined: 14 Apr 2008
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Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy

PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2019 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
garhkal wrote:
Command i don't see as being a Know skill. ITs too linked to persuasion to be, to move it out of perception.

You were in the military; ever have a CO or OIC who was an @$$hole but still got things done because people jumped when he said so?

My point is that there are different styles of command, and not all of them have to do with persuading people or being nice to them.

Not everyone sees the entire Perception attribute as being nice to people. There are multiple ways to influence people, and not all of them are being "nice". Therefore, my Perception "Leadership" skill includes multiple "styles" of command. Also, it seems like the a$$hole CO you are describing may be using Intimidation to get people to do what he says, not Command.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2019 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whill wrote:
Not everyone sees the entire Perception attribute as being nice to people. There are multiple ways to influence people, and not all of them are being "nice". Therefore, my Perception "Leadership" skill includes multiple "styles" of command. Also, it seems like the a$$hole CO you are describing may be using Intimidation to get people to do what he says, not Command.

It could go either way; I can only point out that the opposite style of command may be using Persuasion, not Command.

It's also noteworthy that, as the numbers being coordinated increase, so to does the intellectual acumen needed to keep track of said coordination. Keeping track of who is performing what tasks, and in what order, seems much more a mental exercise than an interpersonal one, especially as the numbers involved increases.

Maybe Leadership would work for small groups, and Command would work for larger groups. The current Command rules aren't written well for groups of more than half a dozen or so, anyway.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whill wrote:
CRMcNeill wrote:
garhkal wrote:
Command i don't see as being a Know skill. ITs too linked to persuasion to be, to move it out of perception.

You were in the military; ever have a CO or OIC who was an @$$hole but still got things done because people jumped when he said so?

My point is that there are different styles of command, and not all of them have to do with persuading people or being nice to them.

Not everyone sees the entire Perception attribute as being nice to people. There are multiple ways to influence people, and not all of them are being "nice". Therefore, my Perception "Leadership" skill includes multiple "styles" of command. Also, it seems like the a$$hole CO you are describing may be using Intimidation to get people to do what he says, not Command.


Exactly. Would you see someone conning you, lying to your face, as being nice??
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 9:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did you know you were being conned while it was happening? How do you think a con works? A con is an unfriendly act disguised as a friendly one, deception as opposed to domination. Would you say Persuasion is also an unfriendly act?
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Whill
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
Did you know you were being conned while it was happening? How do you think a con works? A con is an unfriendly act disguised as a friendly one, deception as opposed to domination. Would you say Persuasion is also an unfriendly act?

Command is not always unfriendly. Sometimes people need lead to do something for their own good.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, I am aware of that.

However, Command can also more closely resemble Intimidation. Command style is usually a mix of stick-and-carrot, with some leaning more one way than the other. As such, the Command skill would sit right on the edge between the two attributes, and if one were looking for a way to increase the utility of Knowledge, moving Command there from Perception would not be amiss.
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Whill
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
Command style is usually a mix of stick-and-carrot, with some leaning more one way than the other. As such, the Command skill would sit right on the edge between the two attributes, and if one were looking for a way to increase the utility of Knowledge, moving Command there from Perception would not be amiss.

I doubt many would agree with you that Command sits on the edge of the two attributes because most would probably not have your view of Knowledge, but I fully support you putting it wherever you feel is appropriate in your game. Maybe as a project you could eventually create a new thread that has all your tweaked attributes definitions and skill reassignments with your justifications?
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