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DirkCorman
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 20 Apr 2014
Posts: 111
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 Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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Would you like some characters for the era?
I play the game, and want to flesh them out.. |
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Mojomoe
Commander
Joined: 10 Apr 2010
Posts: 442
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 1:15 pm Post subject: |
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Dirk - Do you mean PC characters, or NPCs? I've got just about every NPC in the main game detailed and statted, but some PCs might be interesting.
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UPDATE -
I wanted to let everyone know that I've pushed the release back by a few weeks. It's a very minor delay, but I would prefer it rather than rush to release a less than flawless product. I'm taking the time to quadruple check everything, as well as to bring all the stats up to full REUP compatibility. This will be professional quality, nothing less. In regards to suggestions on the Shooting Womp Rats podcast, I'm also adding a fully fleshed out Force section as well.
And besides, if I'm going to follow REUP, I'd better be sure I have a good book! |
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cheshire
Arbiter-General (Moderator)
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 4836
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| Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 3:23 pm Post subject: |
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Would you like another eye to look over the Force section? I did quite a lot of work with converting the SAGA powers over to D6, so at the very least I have some experience.
I'm also the sort that doesn't get in a tizzy if his advice is ignored. 
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Before we take any of this too seriously, just remember that in the middle episode a little rubber puppet moves a spaceship with his mind. |
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Forceally
Commodore
Joined: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 1054
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| Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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I'm willing to help with the Force section as well. As Cheshire can attest to, if I had been informed of this earlier, I could tell you which alien species, creatures, droids, and ships have been stated out already, saving you some time.
I can also understand you wanting to delay for a product of better quality. That was perhaps the major complaint I have with KOTORII The Sith Lords. |
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cheshire
Arbiter-General (Moderator)
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 4836
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| Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 3:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Forceally wrote: | I'm willing to help with the Force section as well. As Cheshire can attest to, if I had been informed of this earlier, I could tell you which alien species, creatures, droids, and ships have been stated out already, saving you some time.
I can also understand you wanting to delay for a product of better quality. That was perhaps the major complaint I have with KOTORII The Sith Lords. |
Hi. My name is Cheshire, and I approve this message.
Okay, seriously, Forceally was the equivalent of our Senior Research Director for the Institute of Star Wars Conversions. You have no idea how much time, stress, and messing up this guy saved me.
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Before we take any of this too seriously, just remember that in the middle episode a little rubber puppet moves a spaceship with his mind. |
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DirkCorman
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 20 Apr 2014
Posts: 111
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| Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 3:37 pm Post subject: |
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NPC's mainly..
and one of them links up to a more modern character i have |
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Mojomoe
Commander
Joined: 10 Apr 2010
Posts: 442
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 10:49 pm Post subject: |
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Dirk - we should chat, I'd love to see what I can apply.
Forceally and Cheshire - now I wish I HAD announced earlier. At the very least, I've found a number of stats that I've already made appearing in the KOTOR D6 companion conversion, which would indeed have saved me time. I'll be going back and adapting most, if not all, of those.
In fact, the D6 KOTOR and the Tales of the Jedi companion are my two touchstones in making TOR D6. As far as I'm concerned, those two books are canon for this era, even though one was written way before and the other is a fan conversion of D20 material. Regardless, since KOTOR D6 exists, it would be foolish for me not to dovetail the two together for the full TOr-era experience. I'm referencing weapons, ship speed and stats, shields, etc.
Out of curiosity, we've gt our D6 statbooks - Ships, Droids, Weapons, etc. is there some reason the D20 conversions aren't included in those? I went hunting for stats and was surprised they only included WEG stats.
Also - what is the collective impression here of RPGGamer.org? I see a lot of unverified stats on his page, and a fair amount of typos and errors - but nothing seems to terribly OP. Thoughts? I ask because other than the D20 conversions, his are the largest collection of aftermarket stats around.
One last question - I see REUP has a lot of ships from the prequel era. Whence do those stats originate? Do they 'soft-canonize' the Rancor Pit conversions, or are they wholly new? It would be great if they solidify some of not all of the stats from this site; what we could really use is a common authority for new stats to make sure they fit the game. That's what I'm aiming for with TOR - and I expect and encourage vigorous vetting of my stats - in order to create the de facto "go to" for stats of this era, making sure they work and balance with the rest of the official and unofficial material. |
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cheshire
Arbiter-General (Moderator)
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
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| Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 11:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Mojomoe wrote: |
Out of curiosity, we've gt our D6 statbooks - Ships, Droids, Weapons, etc. is there some reason the D20 conversions aren't included in those? I went hunting for stats and was surprised they only included WEG stats.
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Great question. The D6 statbooks include a lot of information from the OCR and RCR versions of the d20 books, but nothing from SAGA. Why? Publication date. The stat books were assembled (mostly by Gry Sarth) while WotC was on hiatus with their SW RPG line.
When WOTC announced the new line it actually started a kind of debate. What will be done with the new stats. It seemed only natural that the users on the site will convert them, but how would they be published? We toyed with the idea of a periodical format, but it wound up just kind of congealing as a book-by-book basis. There was some vague expression on Gry's part to re-compile everything into a masterful compendium and re-do the stat books. But in the end, it was just way too much time in reformatting and laying everything out again. By that time, he'd graduated, gotten married, had a kid, and gotten involved in the board gaming end of games (I keep loose tabs on him, even though he isn't on the site anymore).
So, the stat books and the conversion guides stayed their own separate things. It would be a daunting task, imo, to try to re-do all of them, particularly when I'm not sure what has happened to the source files for the stat books.
The best I've been able to do is to put together an index and master table of contents for the SAGA conversions so you can easily search a pdf rather than hunt across a dozen pdfs.
| Mojomoe wrote: |
Also - what is the collective impression here of RPGGamer.org? I see a lot of unverified stats on his page, and a fair amount of typos and errors - but nothing seems to terribly OP. Thoughts? I ask because other than the D20 conversions, his are the largest collection of aftermarket stats around.
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You know, I don't think I've visited that site in ages. I may have to take another look.
| Mojomoe wrote: |
One last question - I see REUP has a lot of ships from the prequel era. Whence do those stats originate? Do they 'soft-canonize' the Rancor Pit conversions, or are they wholly new? It would be great if they solidify some of not all of the stats from this site; what we could really use is a common authority for new stats to make sure they fit the game. That's what I'm aiming for with TOR - and I expect and encourage vigorous vetting of my stats - in order to create the de facto "go to" for stats of this era, making sure they work and balance with the rest of the official and unofficial material. |
Another fascinating question. I've had some conversation with a user involved in the process. Granted, some departments did things differently from each other. However, there are some areas where I can see some of my conversions either directly or nearly directly being used by the REUP. (They've asked if I wanted credit, and I've declined.) Others, they've bumped some of the conversions around to fit their artistic vision.
I wasn't involved in the design elements of that book, but I can see at least a significant influence there. My guess is that they saw no reason to re-invent the wheel, and they used this site's stats as a framework. Other times, they've used the stats directly. (And frankly, I think that's awesome. You have no idea how it feels to see that the things you've had a hand in making becoming the new generally accepted standard.)
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Before we take any of this too seriously, just remember that in the middle episode a little rubber puppet moves a spaceship with his mind. |
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DougRed4
Rear Admiral
Joined: 18 Jan 2013
Posts: 2260
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 1:53 am Post subject: |
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You should have accepted credit, cheshire. No doubt the work you did was great, and you deserve the kudos for doing that work. It's great that your work is seeing use years later!
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Currently Running: Villains & Vigilantes (a 32-year-old campaign with multiple groups) and D6 Star Wars; mostly on hiatus are Adventures in Middle-earth and Delta Green |
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Mojomoe
Commander
Joined: 10 Apr 2010
Posts: 442
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 1:41 pm Post subject: |
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Fascinating answers!
I'm almost afraid to ask, Cheshire, but you say you're still in (semi) contact with Gry? Because it would be fantastic to get one's hands on the original .doc source files for the stat books, if nothing else than for archive proposes. I'm hoping they also exist for the conversions from D20!
I don't know if you've tried to copy anything out of the PDFs, but it comes out as gibberish, since the PDF does not understand paragraph structure, only characters in relation to each other. This means that if, say, the stat books were ever to be REUP updated, or expanded, they would essentially need to be rebuilt from scratch, which is unfortunate. The same is unfortunately true of Forceally's Force Compendium - an AMAZING resource. But the PDF requires much retyping to incorporate.
For this reason I'm keeping a .doc archive of my TOR book for future reference. Is there any chance the source documents exist? |
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cheshire
Arbiter-General (Moderator)
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 4836
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 2:04 pm Post subject: |
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I know that I've got many of my conversion archival materials somewhere, but that only covers my portion of the work, and before I submitted them to the editor (that is to say, e-mailed them to Gry).
I'll hop on to board game geek and see if he's still got them later on today.
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Before we take any of this too seriously, just remember that in the middle episode a little rubber puppet moves a spaceship with his mind. |
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Mojomoe
Commander
Joined: 10 Apr 2010
Posts: 442
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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That would be fantastic! Best of luck tracking that down!
If I could ever get my hands on that stuff it would be immensely helpful; I've been using the broken PDF method to compile my own library. I've currently got all the ships and weapons from the stat books into two excel spreadsheets. SUPER useful for comparison studies and easy reference; I used that to formulate my stats for TOR, making sure they're in line with comparable stats. With a doc format, it would be much easier to grab and format all that tasty, tasty data. |
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Gry Sarth
Jedi
Joined: 25 May 2004
Posts: 5304
Location: Sao Paulo - Brazil
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 8:52 pm Post subject: |
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I come back to you now, at the turn of the tide!
Ahem. So, how can I be of service, my good sir?
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"He's Gry Sarth, of course he has the stats for them." |
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Mojomoe
Commander
Joined: 10 Apr 2010
Posts: 442
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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EEEEEEE! Gry Sarth! My lucky stars, what a twist!
We could certainly use a little assistance . With the new edition of the game out, it would be wonderful to have access to the source .docs used to create the statbooks and D20 conversions (copying text from a PDF is rather problematic). In addition, its such a massive amount of great work, I'm keen to archive it to make it future proof.
I also have a personal interest, having some large projects that would benefit greatly from the source docs - namely a compiled spreadsheet of all ships and weapons, and a 500 page TOR sourcebook. And beyond that, since the statbooks came out before the D20 conversions, the statbooks could be updated to include the conversion work. If I had the source docs, I'd be happy to volunteer to do it myself.
TL,DR; do you happen to have the .docs you made the statbook and D20 conversions from?
Also, welcome back! |
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cheshire
Arbiter-General (Moderator)
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 4836
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 10:30 pm Post subject: |
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I've got a few of my docs on a flash drive. Some of them aren't as complete as I'd like, because in the early days I posted many of my conversions in the discussion boards. The conversion threads are still buried in the forum. If Gry doesn't have them, then I can post or e-mail my source docs.
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