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Smart Missile House Rules
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 1:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I get these rules hammered out, ships will have the attachments included as part of their design, not a field rig.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 2:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

crmcneill wrote:
When I get these rules hammered out, ships will have the attachments included as part of their design, not a field rig.


I thought you were one of those trying to stick to the canon of the films? In none of them do we see any sort of external pods on any ships.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 2:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We don't see any anti-ship attacks using just starfighters either (EDIT: apart from the Death Star and the droid control ship in TPM, but the first was a precision target requiring smaller, more agile weaponry, and the second was an ad hoc attack with what was available), so I could do both and just say we didn't see them in the films, but that doesn't mean they don't exist. In the first X-Wing novel, Rogue Squadron X-Wings were rigged with auxiliary fuel tanks; no stats are listed allowing this to happen, and we never see it in the films, but there is no reason it couldn't.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What of the battle for endor, or the one over Coruscant in RoTS? both had fighters hitting cap ships, and in neither were there any external pod mounts for any fighters.
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CRMcNeill
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Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.

PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

garhkal wrote:
What of the battle for endor, or the one over Coruscant in RoTS? both had fighters hitting cap ships, and in neither were there any external pod mounts for any fighters.

I would probably say that, due to limited availability, external mounted heavy torps and bombs are reserved for situations where starfighters were forced to go up against capital ships with no capital ship support of their own. In the case of both battles, the starfighters were operating in support of or in conjunction with capital ships, which provided the heavy hitting power.

Secondly, I would say that mounting external heavy weaponry overloads a starfighter's normal lift-mass ratio and degrades their performance (-2 Space and -2D Maneuverability with no lower limit for a CS-Scale Torpedo). At the Battle of Endor, the fighters needed speed and maneuverability to fly into the Death Star's superstructure, the same as those who stayed with the fleet on escort duty, so anti-ship torps were not only unnecessary to their mission; they were actually detrimental.
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DougRed4
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Having just used missiles in my game last weekend, I really had to wing it (as I found the existing rules quite confusing).

One thing you might want to consider with the new stuff you come up with, crmcneill, is a Speed (or more specifically, the amount of Space Units traveled per round). Some of us use maps with squares/hexes, and unless they have some kind of speed, there's not much way to model these/use them.

I plan on taking a look at the various CCG cards made for things like Concussion Missiles, to get a better feel for how I might house rule this.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As using hex maps is outside my area of experience, I would likely leave such rules to those who use them. My entire reason for leaving out Speed for missile stats was to simplify things for people who aren't using grid maps and measurements. As such, Speed is considered a factor of Maneuverability, which is the stat the missile uses to hit its target.
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DougRed4
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Even if you don't use hexmaps, you still (presumably) use starships and retain their speeds. I believe the Speed previously spoken of was 10. Would that be fast enough, do you think?

BTW, here's what some of the SWCCG cards say. I realize that these don't hold any special canon significance, but before anyone poo-poos what they say, realize two things:

a) They had to get approval from Lucasfilm, which is far more "offical" than the unofficial Wookieepedia

b) The designers held a lot of reverence for WEG material (as these were made back before many of the compilation books, Wookieepedia, or official Lucasfilm holocron existed.

First off, for the Dark side:

Concussion Missile
Lore: Originally developed by smugglers and pirates as defense against starfighters. Adapted by the Empire to serve as onboard defense for slow moving bombers.
Text: Deploys only on bombers, TIE Defenders, freighters, and transports. Targets all starships, but gets a bonus against starfighters and squadrons.

Light side:

Concussion Missile
Lore: Used by veteran smugglers. Defend transports from maneuverable TIE fighters. Frequently used to arm Rebellion transports and freighters.
Text: Deploys on bombers, A-wings, freighters, and transports. Targets all starships, but gets a bonus against starfighters and squadrons.

Enhanced Proton Torpedoes
Lore: Often modified by Rebellion technicians. Heavy warhead provides increased armor penetration. Decreased maneuverability and effectiveness against starfighters .
Text: Deploys on X-wings, Y-wings, and B-wings. Targets all starships, but works better against capital ships and worse against anything else.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2014 1:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Strange the cards had no Dark side equivelant for the torps..
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DougRed4
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2014 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, they might have for the regular Proton Torpedoes, but not for the Enhanced.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2014 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DougRed4 wrote:
Even if you don't use hexmaps, you still (presumably) use starships and retain their speeds. I believe the Speed previously spoken of was 10. Would that be fast enough, do you think?


The RAW for missile base speed is 15. At All-Out, that would put it at 60 units per round. Of course, the problem then becomes how does the missile roll to beat the difficulty for moving at All-Out with only 4D skill equivalent (per the RAW). Plus, if it is treated as a vehicle, the RAW rules for ramming add their own levels of difficulty.
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