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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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 Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:46 am Post subject: Re: The Implications of Doppleganger |
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| Whill wrote: | | Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote: | | Whill wrote: | | And it apparently causes you to become one with the Force. |
Luke said that he went to that world to die. Like Kenobi, it is implied that Luke has seen his destiny--his own death. Kenobi sacrificed himself so that Luke could escape the Death Star. Luke sacrificed himself to help the Resistance escape.
As soon as Luke finished the Doppleganger effect (Force Projection, I would call it), he collapsed. Like it really took it out of him to do that.
Like doing that took so much out of him that it killed him. |
I agree. |
There aren't rules for it, but it has happened at least once in the old EU where a character burned himself out using the Force (see Dorsk 81).
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Whill wrote: | | But if you are a SW publication author on the story canon team and have the power to just handwave system locations anywhere in the galaxy for a map, and the goal is to conform to what is shown in films, you should not put two systems that the movie shows an extremely short hyperspace journey for on nearly opposite ends of the galaxy from each other. Just saying. |
Agreed. It's like he's not even trying.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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MrNexx
Rear Admiral
Joined: 25 Mar 2016
Posts: 2248
Location: San Antonio
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 6:15 pm Post subject: |
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| MrNexx wrote: | | https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/9kdd97/star-wars-the-last-jedi-review-makes-prequels-good |
IMO, the writer is oversimplifying several parts of the prequels, but makes some good points overall.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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cheshire
Arbiter-General (Moderator)
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 4834
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 8:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Wajeb Deb Kaadeb wrote: | | CRMcNeill wrote: | | Technically, there was gravity inside the ship, which caused them to free-fall out of the bay. |
Nice.
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I think that actual physics get in the way no matter how you try to explain this. The reasons why the bombs fell are the same reasons why we can hear the laser blasts and see fireball explosions in space. 
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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| cheshire wrote: | | The reasons why the bombs fell are the same reasons why we can hear the laser blasts |
This one's easy enough: Ears-Up Displays. Surround-sound systems in the cockpits that provide directional cuing of important events or threats to the pilot without him having to check his sensor displays.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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MrNexx
Rear Admiral
Joined: 25 Mar 2016
Posts: 2248
Location: San Antonio
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | cheshire wrote: | | The reasons why the bombs fell are the same reasons why we can hear the laser blasts |
This one's easy enough: Ears-Up Displays. Surround-sound systems in the cockpits that provide directional cuing of important events or threats to the pilot without him having to check his sensor displays. |
After all, might as well work with the most common hardware in the galaxy...
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cheshire
Arbiter-General (Moderator)
Joined: 04 Jan 2004
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | cheshire wrote: | | The reasons why the bombs fell are the same reasons why we can hear the laser blasts |
This one's easy enough: Ears-Up Displays. Surround-sound systems in the cockpits that provide directional cuing of important events or threats to the pilot without him having to check his sensor displays. |
Now you've just got me curious about what you've got for the zero gravity and space explosions.
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Dredwulf60
Line Captain
Joined: 07 Jan 2016
Posts: 910
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Dredwulf60 wrote: |
And the speeds showed in the movie are pretty much analagous to fighters trying to protect flying bombers on a run. |
| ForbinProject wrote: |
Never criticized speed, so I've no idea why your bringing that up. |
I mentioned it because that was one of my first reactions:
"Why the bloody hell are those ships so bloody slow???"
Shortly after the WWII bomber analogy hit me, and I was like "Ahhh. I see what they're trying to do here."
Figured it was relevant to the discussion of the analogy. Not to imply that you did or did not think or mention something. |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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| cheshire wrote: | | Now you've just got me curious about what you've got for the zero gravity and space explosions. |
Well, according to the TLJ Cross-Section book, the bombs fell so fast because the bomb bays are equipped with sequential magnetic acceleration plates that "fire" the bombs out of the bay faster than gravity would allow. Apart from the feeble acceleration imparted by a 1G grav field with that little distance to work with, it would also allow the bombs to still be dropped if the bomber's artificial gravity was damaged (not that there is any mechanism for that to happen in the RAW, but still).
As far as flames in space, I have nothing concrete. The only theory I can think of is that the explosions are burning off the ship's atmosphere as it leaks out.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10297
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | Problem solved. Per the TLJ Cross-Sections books, the bomb racks used magnetic accelerators. |
| cheshire wrote: | | I think that actual physics get in the way no matter how you try to explain this. The reasons why the bombs fell... |
That one's easy. We have that technology on Earth now, and magnetic launchers would be much more effective in Zero G than here on Earth.
And an even easier explanation for the starship engine sounds in space is that it is only there for us real world viewers and not in-universe at all. There isn't actually John Williams music playing in space either. 8)
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ForbinProject
Commander
Joined: 16 May 2016
Posts: 318
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| Posted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 6:00 am Post subject: |
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| Dredwulf60 wrote: | I mentioned it because that was one of my first reactions:
"Why the bloody hell are those ships so bloody slow???"
Shortly after the WWII bomber analogy hit me, and I was like "Ahhh. I see what they're trying to do here."
Figured it was relevant to the discussion of the analogy. Not to imply that you did or did not think or mention something. |
Ahh. I just figured the ships looked like they were moving slow because of the distances. When you look at a jet in the sky it looks like it's moving slowly unless it's really close to you.
We were able to get the concept of the fighters being faster because they were close enough to the bombers for us to spot the acceleration.
The head to head runs seem even faster because ships are accelerating towards each other. There's math to explain it but it goes over my head. |
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MrNexx
Rear Admiral
Joined: 25 Mar 2016
Posts: 2248
Location: San Antonio
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| Posted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: |
As far as flames in space, I have nothing concrete. The only theory I can think of is that the explosions are burning off the ship's atmosphere as it leaks out. |
I would add "And fuel, and reserve atmosphere", but, yeah. You might get a short-lived puff of flame, which is cinematically enhanced for coolness factor.
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“We're going to win this war, not by fighting what we hate, but saving what we love.”
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MrNexx
Rear Admiral
Joined: 25 Mar 2016
Posts: 2248
Location: San Antonio
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| Posted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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An aside:
https://twitter.com/inknose/status/942851355479244800
| @inknose wrote: | | ppl are hung up on who rey's dad is & meanwhile chewie is right there. driving her to jedi practice. keeping the engine running. dropping her off to meet the new boyfriend he doesn't exactly approve of, but just tells her to get home safe. her search for a father figure is OVER |
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"I've Seen Your Daily Routine. You Are Not Busy!"
“We're going to win this war, not by fighting what we hate, but saving what we love.”
http://rpgcrank.blogspot.com/ |
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garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14034
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 4:02 pm Post subject: Re: Star Wars VIII: The Last Jedi |
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| Whill wrote: | .
Before dying, Luke said "I will not be the last Jedi" clearly referring to Rey. Sometimes I amaze even myself. |
Technically he could have also meant Kylo or Leia..
| crazydanny1 wrote: | 1. Snoke can't be dead. Hux and Ren running around in charge of the First Order seems like the rich kids getting mad and throwing temper tantrums when they don't get their way because they are who they are. Snoke has to come back to reign those two toddlers in...
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Hux i don't see like a rich spoilt brat, Kylo, Absolutely..
| crazydanny1 wrote: | 2. Rey and Poe are so going to hook up after that intro on the Falcon.
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Maybe that asian lady who saved him might be a better hook up..
| crazydanny1 wrote: | 3. The Yoda scene felt a little off...
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Especially when Yoda summoned down several bolts of lightning to scorch the tree.. BUT i still liked his appearance..
| crazydanny1 wrote: | 4. Waaay more humor than I expected, especially given that VIII was supposed to be darker than V. Don't get me wrong, though. VIII is filled with darkness.
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To the max.. We saw what, 30 ships leave that cruiser, and what 6 make it down. The rest got blown up!
| crazydanny1 wrote: | 5. Did anyone notice that the Jedi books from the tree were in the drawer on the Falcon when Finn opens in up towards the end?
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Rey took them maybe?!
| crazydanny1 wrote: | 6. I'm not settled on the "Rey's parents were nothing" bit. I still think we've got a big reveal coming up. My theory is that Rey is Ezra and Sabine's kid.
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I disagree on it being Ezra and sabine.. BUT i do agree, the whole 'they are nobodies is bupkis'.
| Drewulf60 wrote: | 6: I agree. That's just the sort of thing Kylo would want to tell her. I think she's definitely a skywalker; I think she's related to Kylo. Leia and Han seemed to know her in TFA. She'll find out in the next movie and be asking Luke's force ghost why he didn't tell her the truth...
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But then why didn't Luke seem interested in her being his daughter?
| Drewulf60 wrote: | AND for some reason they don't send 200,000 TIEs and bomber variants to cripple the fleeing ships?
OR have a couple star destroyers hyperspace into the path of the fleeing rebel ships?? |
Hubris, wanting to toy with the rebels before slaughtering them?
| Whill wrote: | | I agree. I still think it is most likely that Rey is a Skywalker either biologically or spiritually. The junk collectors thing (or whatever it was) could still be part of the truth if Rey is the reincarnation of Anakin. |
Maybe she was cloned BY Snork, from some of luke's DNA??
| Whill wrote: | | The biggest thing that irked me was that Snoke, Ren and Hux somehow never found out that Phasma is the one who lowered the Starkiller shields which allowed for the Resistance attack and the entire planet to be destroyed. I can't imagine that they didn't know and if they did why they wouldn't have killed her for it. Only her own life was on the line. She did it to save her own neck and I can't imagine how her superiors would find that level of disloyalty acceptable. The Resistance victory is literally all her fault. |
Maybe they DID know, but knew she was 'forced' into it. However, with how she seemed to die this time, i can't see her coming back for #3.
| Azai wrote: |
And yet he had such a powerful moment of weakness? And such a fear of the darkness within a force user and his family member? It seems like Luke would be the most well equipped force user ever to deal with anyone's darkness, and have great empathy for the darkness in the Skywalker line. Not to be afraid of it, but to handle it like he handled his father.
Though other than that I really, really, did enjoy the film. |
I agree. It didn't seem like the Luke who stood and FACED DOWN Emperor palpaltine and turned vader back to the light.
BUT he has had what, 20+ years since then to age, grow into regrets etc.. So maybe he found some things out in his hiatus that made him reconsider.?
Cont next post.
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