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Maximum damage values for melee weapons
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Fallon Kell
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jmanski wrote:
Yeah, but armor and a blast door are two different things. That's like comparing a kevlar vest to a tank.
That's true, but I'd say if armor compares to rotted cloth, then a tank compares nicely to hardwood, which I can make progress on with my knife.
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Azai
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also there is a lot of angles you could come do with a sword onto armor, that you really couldn't against a door.

Even if things don't match up all the time my players enjoy the no maximum damage when fighting baddies, and respect it when I say "No you can't cut the Speeder in half"
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Kaloth Varsk
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, lets look at it this way with weapons. Once I cleave through you, does more strength matter? Most of these max damages are pretty high.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 1:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kaloth Varsk wrote:
Ok, lets look at it this way with weapons. Once I cleave through you, does more strength matter? Most of these max damages are pretty high.

Most are 6d... some 7d.. Only iirc the Jengardin double edged vibro blade and the vibro axe are higher
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Esoomian
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kaloth Varsk wrote:
Ok, lets look at it this way with weapons. Once I cleave through you, does more strength matter? Most of these max damages are pretty high.


The problem a lot of people have is that some races have maximum strength ratings of close to or over 6D so that makes a good number of those weapons pointless.
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ZzaphodD
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kaloth Varsk wrote:
Ok, lets look at it this way with weapons. Once I cleave through you, does more strength matter? Most of these max damages are pretty high.


You look at it the wrong way. A maximum weapon damage of 6D does not mean that I cleave you. A 'Killed' result (with some to spare) on the Wound chart does.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Esoomian wrote:
Kaloth Varsk wrote:
Ok, lets look at it this way with weapons. Once I cleave through you, does more strength matter? Most of these max damages are pretty high.


The problem a lot of people have is that some races have maximum strength ratings of close to or over 6D so that makes a good number of those weapons pointless.


Then they are better just brawling!
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atgxtg
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the real reason for the damage caps was to prevent melee weapons from outclassing missile weapons. Melee weapons are much better in D6 Star Wars, relative to misile weapons than they are in most RPGs or in real life. A strong guy (3D) with a knife in the RPG can do as much damage as a typical rifle (4D) in the game. The cap prevents everyone from focusing on melee weapons.

I just wish WEG had set up some sort of standard rule for the cap that we could apply to all melee weapons, rather than the haphphazard method they used and often failed to apply. And I still do accept that a strong Wookie would do less damage with a knife than with a punch.

Melee weaponsd also got a bit of a "power up" in 2E, with the revised damage table. in 1E weapons need to do a lot of damage to get any result better than wounded. Lightsabers needed that fistful of dice to get the 3xSTR results. But since the revsioin in damage melee weapons and lightsabers have become much more dangerous. Each die of damage is amlost a shift up on the damage table.

I'd be all for a revision along the lines of capping melee weapons at twice thier damage bonus +3D, OR the STR or the wielders STR+1 or some such, and applying it to all melee weapons.
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Bren
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wonder if redoing melee weapon damage so it was less STR based and more weapon based might work better, i.e. similar to the D6 Space rules.

A 2 handed axe or sword does 3D+1 damage, a rapier does 2D, and a knife or dagger does 1D. To that you add the STR bonus which is half of the D score rounded up.

    STR............Bonus
    1D-2D+2.....+1D
    3D-4D+2.....+2D
    5D-6D+2.....+3D


So a Wookiee with a dagger would do 4D damage while a normal human with a 2 handed axe would do 4D+1 damage. The Wookiee with a 2-handed axe would do 6D+1. Overall this seems more reasonable, aligns better with a blaster rifle doing 5D damage, and would avoid the need for a damage cap.
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Esoomian
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So how does that system work for fighting without weapons, is the bonus the damage rating for bare-handed strikes?
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Bren
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that is correct.

Also, there are special melee and brawling maneuvers that can increase or decrease the difficulty and the damage or provide special effects.
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Kaloth Varsk
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bren wrote:
I wonder if redoing melee weapon damage so it was less STR based and more weapon based might work better, i.e. similar to the D6 Space rules.

A 2 handed axe or sword does 3D+1 damage, a rapier does 2D, and a knife or dagger does 1D. To that you add the STR bonus which is half of the D score rounded up.

    STR............Bonus
    1D-2D+2.....+1D
    3D-4D+2.....+2D
    5D-6D+2.....+3D


So a Wookiee with a dagger would do 4D damage while a normal human with a 2 handed axe would do 4D+1 damage. The Wookiee with a 2-handed axe would do 6D+1. Overall this seems more reasonable, aligns better with a blaster rifle doing 5D damage, and would avoid the need for a damage cap.


I love it. I think I'm adopting this from now on. Brawling becomes less deadly, and melee becomes about evenly deadly with shooting.
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Esoomian
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 2:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bren wrote:
I think that is correct.

Also, there are special melee and brawling maneuvers that can increase or decrease the difficulty and the damage or provide special effects.


I have vague memories of a conversation with someone who used to frequent this site. He mentioned that the lifting skill came into it for determining damage so if you had a lifting skill of 6D (IE 4D strenth and 2D lifting) then the damage bonus was actually 3D, half 6D not half 4D.

I can't recall if that was a house rule or a standard rule but I liked it as it meant it was possible to be able to hit harder without actually having to be better at fighting.
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Bren
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Esoomian wrote:
I have vague memories of a conversation with someone who used to frequent this site. He mentioned that the lifting skill came into it for determining damage...
That's correct.
From page 9 of the PDF version of the OGL D6 Space rules:
Page 9 wrote:
Strength Damage: Drop the pips from your character’s Strength or lift score (including any Special Abilities or Disadvantages that affect the die code),
divide the number by 2, and round up. This is the Strength Damage die code.

Makes raising the lift skill a darn site more useful.
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Esoomian
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So if you could get your lift skill up to 9D you'd get a hefty 5D bonus to melee damage or do a respectable 5D damage when unarmed.

I suppose then you'd get people trying to game the system and taking specialities in lifting: (s) Doing damage. Rolling Eyes
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