| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Jedi Skyler
Moff
Joined: 07 Sep 2005
Posts: 8440
|
 Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 4:24 am Post subject: |
 |
|
| masque wrote: | I use a variant on that myself. Every time a player uses a skill successfully I have them put a tick mark by it on their character sheet, and those are the skills that they can increase with CPs without having to deal with "training." I figure experience in "real life" situations is just as good, if not better than training.
I also came up with a house rule where if someone successfully attempts to use a skill that they don't have using their default attribute then I give them a pip in that skill for the cost of one CP. So if the player's Technical was 3D+1, and they succeeded at a Computer Programming at 3D+1, I'll let them go to 3D+1 for 1 CP. After that they increase it as normal, of course, but I find that it encourages the players to try out new things and broaden their skill bases without unbalancing the game (since everyone can do it, of course). |
I really like that, masque. Sounds like a really good way to get some broad, well-rounded parties going.
Do you use that rule for the Force as well, or do you still impose the double-CP cost for no Master? Or do you even compromise it a little and meet them halfway? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
masque
Captain
Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 626
Location: Houston, TX
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 5:02 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Jedi Skyler wrote: | I really like that, masque. Sounds like a really good way to get some broad, well-rounded parties going.
Do you use that rule for the Force as well, or do you still impose the double-CP cost for no Master? Or do you even compromise it a little and meet them halfway? |
I didn't have any Force users in the campaign, and since we were playing during the Rebellion (between ANH and ESB, specifically) it was unlikely that we'd find any master if there were any Force users. The party was a smuggler, a slicer, an arms dealer and a pilot/speeder racer, so I'm not sure what I would have done for Force users. (The campaign is ended for now, we're taking a break from Star Wars, and I'm working on setting up a HARP campaign with the Cyradon setting.) One of my players, the guy playing the pilot/racer eventually took over as GM, and his character was Force sensitive, but the Force didn't crop up as an issue until the finale of the campaign, (he got possessed by a dead Jedi, briefly) so when we resurrect that campaign, I suppose I'll figure it out then, if I'm running it.
The only time period that I'm actually interested in running a Jedi campaign would be during the Tales of the Jedi comic book era, so there'd be masters aplenty then. The rule would probably apply there.
_________________
Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jedi Skyler
Moff
Joined: 07 Sep 2005
Posts: 8440
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 6:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Interesting. I'm in a couple KOTOR campaigns, and they're a blast. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
masque
Captain
Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 626
Location: Houston, TX
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 2:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
One of these days I'll probably finish playing KOTOR, but it didn't seem that great to me when I bought it. Granted, I haven't played it much more than a few hours, but it seemed way too D20ish to me, and I rarely have the patience for computer based RPGs, anyway. Too much tedium, not enough reward.
_________________
Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
slaughterj
Lieutenant
Joined: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 79
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 3:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Ankhanu wrote: | Somewhere along the lines I thought that slaughterj was saying that Jedi were too powerful, so I started providing mechanics for changing that within a campaign... but upon quickly reviewing the thread, he wasn't looking for that at all. Slaughterj, you may disregard my suggestions for limiting Jedi progress, as, well, it's not something you're interested in doing  |
LOL!  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
slaughterj
Lieutenant
Joined: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 79
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 3:20 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| garhkal wrote: | | slaughterj wrote: | And finally, a Force user can't just drop points in force skills, they have many other skills to increase as well, so they won't get too strong too quickly by skipping over gaming during training time and going straight to the adventures between training most of the time.
|
Actually nearly everyone i have known who had jedi characters, dropped all available CP in to their force abilities till they hit 6-7d, THEN started to worry about the rest of their skills... though dodge and lightsaber also always went up too. |
Even without a master available to help them avoid the double cost? I find that no one is willing spend the double cost, so they only increase force skills when a means for increasing them is available at normal cost. Effectively that lets the GM control the force increases. They figure that while no teaching method is available, then don't waste points on the double cost, but instead increase other things they are interested in. And I find force users to find other skills to be of use, maybe one of the supplemental starship skills (e.g., shield operation, gunnery, etc.) to help out the party, etc. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
slaughterj
Lieutenant
Joined: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 79
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 3:22 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Jedi Skyler wrote: | Well, that can be easily curtailed using the method one of my GMs uses:
IF YOU DIDN'T USE THE SKILL, YOU CAN'T RAISE IT THIS TIME!!!
That way, if the Jedi was running around doing this and that, but not using the Force, they're not going to get to add CPs to any of the Force skills during an award session because they didn't practice that skill. As long as the GM is across the board with this, holding ALL players to this rule, there should be no problems. |
That's all well and good but:
1. As others noted, it's easy for the force to get used during an adventure, so this isn't really a limitation at all, and
2. If force users have to be spending so much "off-time" training with masters, etc., then it stands to reason that characters can also spend "off-time" training learning other things as well, not just what they happened to use in an adventure, so I don't use this constraint on increasing skills. However, for other games, I have used this as a reward to increasing little used skills that get a good use from an adventure (in addition to the actual "XP" awarded), and maybe I'll try it for SW as well. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
slaughterj
Lieutenant
Joined: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 79
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 3:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| masque wrote: | | I use a variant on that myself. Every time a player uses a skill successfully I have them put a tick mark by it on their character sheet, and those are the skills that they can increase with CPs without having to deal with "training." I figure experience in "real life" situations is just as good, if not better than training. |
And if training is good, why shouldn't a character choose to do some training in any given skill during down time between adventures, increasing that skill with XP?
| masque wrote: | | I also came up with a house rule where if someone successfully attempts to use a skill that they don't have using their default attribute then I give them a pip in that skill for the cost of one CP. So if the player's Technical was 3D+1, and they succeeded at a Computer Programming at 3D+1, I'll let them go to 3D+1 for 1 CP. After that they increase it as normal, of course, but I find that it encourages the players to try out new things and broaden their skill bases without unbalancing the game (since everyone can do it, of course). |
That doesn't make sense to me. Anybody can do any skill at their default attribute if they don't have the skill, right? You say you are using this house rule to encourage players to broaden skill bases, but instead it seems the opposite because you are charging them 1 CP to go to 3D+1 in the skill which is the same as the default attribute. Unless you had a typo, and meant to increase the skill from the default attribute value of 3D+1 to 3D+2 for 1 CP - then maybe it would be useful? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Esoomian
High Admiral
Joined: 29 Oct 2003
Posts: 6207
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 3:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| masque wrote: | | I also came up with a house rule where if someone successfully attempts to use a skill that they don't have using their default attribute then I give them a pip in that skill for the cost of one CP. So if the player's Technical was 3D+1, and they succeeded at a Computer Programming at 3D+1, I'll let them go to 3D+1 for 1 CP. After that they increase it as normal, of course, but I find that it encourages the players to try out new things and broaden their skill bases without unbalancing the game (since everyone can do it, of course). |
I've played in games with this house rule although slightly different. If you were using a skill you didn't have (IE base attribute) and succeeded then you got a free knowledge roll (difficulty depending on the complexity of the skill) if you passed that roll then you got a free pip in the skill you succeeded in.
| slaughterj wrote: | | That doesn't make sense to me. Anybody can do any skill at their default attribute if they don't have the skill, right? You say you are using this house rule to encourage players to broaden skill bases, but instead it seems the opposite because you are charging them 1 CP to go to 3D+1 in the skill which is the same as the default attribute. Unless you had a typo, and meant to increase the skill from the default attribute value of 3D+1 to 3D+2 for 1 CP - then maybe it would be useful? |
It makes sense if there is a penalty to using skills you're untrained in. If you have a skill at 3D+1 and your base attribute is 3D+1 you are not untrained in the skill (so no penalty) but you're not trained in it either,
_________________
Don't waste money on expensive binoculars.
Simply stand closer to the object you wish to view. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
masque
Captain
Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 626
Location: Houston, TX
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 6:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| slaughterj wrote: | | That doesn't make sense to me. Anybody can do any skill at their default attribute if they don't have the skill, right? You say you are using this house rule to encourage players to broaden skill bases, but instead it seems the opposite because you are charging them 1 CP to go to 3D+1 in the skill which is the same as the default attribute. Unless you had a typo, and meant to increase the skill from the default attribute value of 3D+1 to 3D+2 for 1 CP - then maybe it would be useful? |
That was indeed a typo, it should read 3D+2. Sorry about that.
_________________
Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
masque
Captain
Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 626
Location: Houston, TX
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 6:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| slaughterj wrote: | | And if training is good, why shouldn't a character choose to do some training in any given skill during down time between adventures, increasing that skill with XP? |
I don't have a problem with downtime training, it just never worked out that way. We generally gave out CPs at the end of every session (with a few exceptions) and spent them right away on the skills with tick marks by them. I guess the only problem with the downtime thing is that I don't recall having much. I suppose there was some while in hyperspace, and I do recall one player specifically mentioning he was practicing some skill or another, but for the most part we jacked up the skills we were using on a per session basis.
_________________
Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14354
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
|
| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 8:03 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| slaughterj wrote: |
Even without a master available to help them avoid the double cost? I find that no one is willing spend the double cost, so they only increase force skills when a means for increasing them is available at normal cost. Effectively that lets the GM control the force increases. They figure that while no teaching method is available, then don't waste points on the double cost, but instead increase other things they are interested in. And I find force users to find other skills to be of use, maybe one of the supplemental starship skills (e.g., shield operation, gunnery, etc.) to help out the party, etc. |
Being this is in the sparks group we have higher 'dice' pcs who train the others, so there is always (or almost always) someone who can train for the force..
_________________
Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jedi Skyler
Moff
Joined: 07 Sep 2005
Posts: 8440
|
| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 2:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
I have spent the double cost before.
And it wasn't only even for beginning level characters. It just depends on the story and what I need to advance that character in... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
noctum_carpe
Rear Admiral
Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 2466
Location: Lidköping, Sweden
|
| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 4:47 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Jedi Skyler wrote: | I have spent the double cost before.
And it wasn't only even for beginning level characters. It just depends on the story and what I need to advance that character in... |
And you will:D
_________________
http://selarips.free.fr/wookieetranslator/
You may fire when ready |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jedi Skyler
Moff
Joined: 07 Sep 2005
Posts: 8440
|
| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 4:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
Yeah, I already figured with you... 
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
