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Fallon Kell
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Joined: 07 Mar 2011
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Location: Tacoma, WA
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 Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2011 4:20 pm Post subject: Odd Firearm stat question |
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Okay, so this may seem a bit odd, (and painful to those with real-world knowledge,) but I'm trying to come up with range and damage stats for a revolver with a 10 inch barrel, chambered in .30-06 with heavy bullets.
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garhkal
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Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14034
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 1:36 am Post subject: |
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For a 30.6 round, i would go with a pistol version of my hunting rifle..
Type: Heavy hunting pistol, Slugthrower
Scale: Firearms (s) Pistols
Ammo: 5 round revolver drum
Cost: 500 credits. Ammo – 80 credits per 50 rounds. Spare clip – 100 credits.
Availability: 1F, deep core is 1R
Fire rate: 2.
Damage: 4d+1
Range: 5-30/60/120
Recoil value: +4.
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Fallon Kell
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Joined: 07 Mar 2011
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Location: Tacoma, WA
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 1:39 am Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | For a 30.6 round, i would go with a pistol version of my hunting rifle..
Type: Heavy hunting pistol, Slugthrower
Scale: Firearms (s) Pistols
Ammo: 5 round revolver drum
Cost: 500 credits. Ammo – 80 credits per 50 rounds. Spare clip – 100 credits.
Availability: 1F, deep core is 1R
Fire rate: 2.
Damage: 4d+1
Range: 5-30/60/120
Recoil value: +4. |
Recoil value?
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Grimace
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Joined: 11 Oct 2004
Posts: 729
Location: Montana; Big Sky Country
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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Recoil is something Star Wars never had for its slugthrowers but should have. Want to pump out more than one shot from some slugthrowers? Well you'll have to contend with the weapon jumping around from previous shots you've fired.
I'm guessing, if it's anything even remotely like the recoil that I use for weapons, it's added to the difficulty when firing the weapon. |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Grimace wrote: | Recoil is something Star Wars never had for its slugthrowers but should have. Want to pump out more than one shot from some slugthrowers? Well you'll have to contend with the weapon jumping around from previous shots you've fired.
I'm guessing, if it's anything even remotely like the recoil that I use for weapons, it's added to the difficulty when firing the weapon. |
Good point. So how would that work in D6 rules?
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Fallon Kell
Commodore
Joined: 07 Mar 2011
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Location: Tacoma, WA
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 2:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Grimace wrote: | Recoil is something Star Wars never had for its slugthrowers but should have. Want to pump out more than one shot from some slugthrowers? Well you'll have to contend with the weapon jumping around from previous shots you've fired.
I'm guessing, if it's anything even remotely like the recoil that I use for weapons, it's added to the difficulty when firing the weapon. |
So why the low fire rate too? I know you need a big gun for this type of thing, but does it really take 2 seconds for the cylinder to turn to the next chamber?
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Grimace
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Location: Montana; Big Sky Country
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 3:51 pm Post subject: |
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The slow rate of fire I can't speak for, honestly. *shrug*
As for how it would work in D6; this is how I work it:
For any additional shots in the same round, over the first, add in the recoil value to the difficulty to hit (as well as subtracting dice for multiple actions).
So if you have a weapon with a recoil of +4, you fire one shot, everything is basic. If you want to fire two shots in a round, you suffer -1D for two actions, but you also suffer a +4 to the difficulty to hit the target on the second shot due to recoil.
Again, I'm not sure if this is exactly how garhkal works the rules, but that's how I do. His version might be slightly different than mine. |
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garhkal
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Joined: 17 Jul 2005
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Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Grimace wrote: | Recoil is something Star Wars never had for its slugthrowers but should have. Want to pump out more than one shot from some slugthrowers? Well you'll have to contend with the weapon jumping around from previous shots you've fired.
I'm guessing, if it's anything even remotely like the recoil that I use for weapons, it's added to the difficulty when firing the weapon. |
That it is..
EG Therlm the sniper has taken aim at a guard in a tower. The guard is near the outer end of medium range (moderate diff, 13), and has, cause of the tower's parapets 50% cover (+2d, 8 rolled) for a total of 21 needed to hit him. BUT his rifle's recoil value is +4.. So to successfully shot him, Therlm needs to rol 25 on his to hit roll.
| Quote: | | Again, I'm not sure if this is exactly how garhkal works the rules, but that's how I do. His version might be slightly different than mine. |
With me, the recoil value applies to every shot.
As to the low RoF.. i could see upping it to 4...
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thedemonapostle
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Joined: 02 Aug 2011
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Location: Texas
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Fallon Kell
Commodore
Joined: 07 Mar 2011
Posts: 1846
Location: Tacoma, WA
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:43 pm Post subject: Re: medium caliber rifle round in a pistol |
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| garhkal wrote: | | Grimace wrote: | Recoil is something Star Wars never had for its slugthrowers but should have. Want to pump out more than one shot from some slugthrowers? Well you'll have to contend with the weapon jumping around from previous shots you've fired.
I'm guessing, if it's anything even remotely like the recoil that I use for weapons, it's added to the difficulty when firing the weapon. |
That it is..
EG Therlm the sniper has taken aim at a guard in a tower. The guard is near the outer end of medium range (moderate diff, 13), and has, cause of the tower's parapets 50% cover (+2d, 8 rolled) for a total of 21 needed to hit him. BUT his rifle's recoil value is +4.. So to successfully shot him, Therlm needs to rol 25 on his to hit roll.
| Quote: | | Again, I'm not sure if this is exactly how garhkal works the rules, but that's how I do. His version might be slightly different than mine. |
With me, the recoil value applies to every shot.
As to the low RoF.. i could see upping it to 4... |
So why does the recoil increase the difficulty of the first shot? It only takes about a 5/10,000 of a second for the bullet to leave the barrel, and I'd be surprised to see the shot get that much harder during that time.
I find a good baseline for sci-fi firearms is "slightly more powerful than practical". Knowing that .30-06 is popular for being at the top of the recoil spectrum for most shooters, and that the Magnum Research BFR can be chambered in .30-30, I decided .30-06 would be the right chamber size for my NPCs. (I also like the look 2 inch x 3.5 inch 7 round cylinder I drew for it!) I was aware of the Zeliska, but it's a little too big for these purposes.
I chose a revolver because of their simplicity and reliability. The guys carrying them will be from a volcanic ash-choked world that has been at intercontinental war for centuries. As you seem to be experienced in the military and with firearms, I think you can appreciate the value of a reliable firearm in such an environment, and the AK-47 simply isn't accurate enough!
(And the old west/space cowboy look is a major plus.)
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Esoomian
High Admiral
Joined: 29 Oct 2003
Posts: 6207
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2011 12:13 am Post subject: Re: medium caliber rifle round in a pistol |
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| Fallon Kell wrote: | | So why does the recoil increase the difficulty of the first shot? It only takes about a 5/10,000 of a second for the bullet to leave the barrel, and I'd be surprised to see the shot get that much harder during that time. |
I could see it if it was a psychological thing, the person firing the gun knowing there is going to be a kick and leaning into the recoil too early or something like that.
However by that logic someone who has no concept or recoil should be able to get that first shot off without the recoil modifier but may injure themselves in the process.
A friend of mine has a scar on his face from where the recoil of a rifle pushed the scope back into him.
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
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Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2011 12:55 am Post subject: Re: medium caliber rifle round in a pistol |
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| thedemonapostle wrote: | | personally id put the stats as: |
The gun looks like a monster, but I'm not sure I'd put it at the same Damage as a disruptor pistol. Even maximum strength blaster pistols like the Thunderer only get as high as 6D+2.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
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thedemonapostle
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Location: Texas
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thedemonapostle
Commander
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2011 1:24 am Post subject: Re: medium caliber rifle round in a pistol |
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| crmcneill wrote: | | thedemonapostle wrote: | | personally id put the stats as: |
The gun looks like a monster, but I'm not sure I'd put it at the same Damage as a disruptor pistol. Even maximum strength blaster pistols like the Thunderer only get as high as 6D+2. |
i took every blaster i knew of, which is considerable, and i kept the shatter gun in mind as well when i put the damage for it at 7D. why so high? why is it roughly the same as a medium repeating blaster? simple, it is a huge and heavy round hitting with similar force as a professional boxer/mma fighter but with a smaller surface area thus allowing for greater penetration of soft tissues. but as we all know that the armor in star wars is more resistant to firearms than modern armors, which led to the downfall of fire arms and the rise of blasters. so even using the thunderer and the Zeliska against a standard storm trooper, the thunderer would do more damage. even without using the firearms damage modifications against modern armors rules.
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Fallon Kell
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Location: Tacoma, WA
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2011 1:50 am Post subject: |
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I do like the judge!
Anyways, .30-06 is the baseline I'm using. The actual ammo used will be different in the game, but only slightly. For example, a .30-06s' nominal caliber is .30, but the actual bullet diameter is .308 inches. Mine is .310 inches. There will be other minor changes, too.
I was also considering that it would have different characteristics fired from a revolver than a rifle. I took care in the original post to mention the barrel length at 10 inches, and that it was a revolver. (gasses can escape through the gap between the cylinder and the barrel, costing muzzle energy.)
I made up the gun I want, but I didn't really know what the stats should look like... Thank you though to garhkal and thedemonapostle for your suggestions!
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