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ZzaphodD
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 Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: |
IMO, a rule mechanic should be a realistic depiction of "real life" action. AFAIC, the only reason a Jedi would be able to do both actions at once would be because of the precognitive guidance of the Force. He wouldn't need to figure out which blaster shots would hit; the Force would let him know. Throwing in the Dodge roll simply makes it less likely for him to need to parry the shots. |
Well, using the force IS an action.. 
Otherwise your description perfectly fits my mechanic.
Also, regarding 'realistic depiction of "real life", then most RPGs (and a simple system such as D6 in particular) are not your cup of tea. We can just mention the penalty for firing a gun twice within 10 seconds and leave it at that... 
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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| ZzaphodD wrote: | | Also, regarding 'realistic depiction of "real life", then most RPGs (and a simple system such as D6 in particular) are not your cup of tea. We can just mention the penalty for firing a gun twice within 10 seconds and leave it at that... :lol: |
I thought a round was five seconds (2R&E Rulebook, pg. 77). Regardless, I usually don't use set time limits on combat rounds; its easier to just treat the -1D MAP as the penalty for firing your gun twice as fast as normal within a given period of time. The better you are with that gun, the more likely you are to get off multiple accurate shots (or just plain multiple shots) within a non-specific period of time.
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
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Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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| ZzaphodD wrote: | | Also, regarding 'realistic depiction of "real life", then most RPGs (and a simple system such as D6 in particular) are not your cup of tea. We can just mention the penalty for firing a gun twice within 10 seconds and leave it at that... :lol: |
I thought a round was five seconds (2R&E Rulebook, pg. 77). Regardless, I usually don't use set time limits on combat rounds; its easier to just treat the -1D MAP as the penalty for firing your gun twice as fast as normal within a given period of time. The better you are with that gun, the more likely you are to get off multiple accurate shots (or just plain multiple shots) within a non-specific period of time.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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| ZzaphodD wrote: | Well, using the force IS an action.. :wink:
Otherwise your description perfectly fits my mechanic. |
Does it count as an action if he already has Lightsaber Combat up? That would be the source of the information used on the parry. The description on LC doesn't say that you have to make two separate rolls to determine what's going to hit you and then to parry those shots. It just says you get a roll to parry.
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ZzaphodD
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 7:04 pm Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: | | ZzaphodD wrote: | Well, using the force IS an action..
Otherwise your description perfectly fits my mechanic. |
Does it count as an action if he already has Lightsaber Combat up? That would be the source of the information used on the parry. The description on LC doesn't say that you have to make two separate rolls to determine what's going to hit you and then to parry those shots. It just says you get a roll to parry. |
Just like the RAW parry is an action, so is this. Thoght that had been established allready.
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Bren
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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| 2R&E p 77 wrote: | | Each round represents five seconds of time - give or take a few seconds for dramatic license. |
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 7:10 pm Post subject: |
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| ZzaphodD wrote: | | Just like the RAW parry is an action, so is this. Thoght that had been established allready. |
I haven't been paying close attention to most of this discussion, so I wanted to make sure you weren't throwing an additional MAP on top of the parry roll to identify which shots he needed to parry. If the Jedi already has LC up, and only has to face the -1D MAP for the dodge and the parry (not counting penalties for multiple shots), then I don't see a problem. Based on some of my past discussions with G, I'm going to hazard a guess that his main objection has more to do with it unbalancing things in favor of the Jedi.
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ZzaphodD
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 7:11 pm Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: | | ZzaphodD wrote: | | Also, regarding 'realistic depiction of "real life", then most RPGs (and a simple system such as D6 in particular) are not your cup of tea. We can just mention the penalty for firing a gun twice within 10 seconds and leave it at that... |
I thought a round was five seconds (2R&E Rulebook, pg. 77). Regardless, I usually don't use set time limits on combat rounds; its easier to just treat the -1D MAP as the penalty for firing your gun twice as fast as normal within a given period of time. The better you are with that gun, the more likely you are to get off multiple accurate shots (or just plain multiple shots) within a non-specific period of time. |
Well no matter, my point stands. Firing two shots within 5 seconds is not more difficult than firing 1 every other five seconds.
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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| ZzaphodD wrote: | | Well no matter, my point stands. Firing two shots within 5 seconds is not more difficult than firing 1 every other five seconds. |
I must disagree with you here. Reducing the number of shots allows you to take your time and focus on your technique and take extra care when aiming. This is the principle behind the Preparation rule, and it has real life parallels. Military snipers have near-ritualistic procedures used to prep a shot, controlling their bodies down to the smallest detail. You are far more likely to hit a target if you take your time and do it right than you are if you use the spray & pray technique, and that is what MAPs on firing weapons represents.
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Bren
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 7:24 pm Post subject: |
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Shooting a hangun once every 2-3 seconds is not more difficult than shooting once every five seconds in my shooting experience.
The +1D bonus for taking a round to prepare seems to adequately account for prepared shots be they by snipers or otherwise.
But if I was going to argue that the game is not realistic, look no further than the lack of simultaneity of actions including movement and firing. |
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Bren wrote: | | But if I was going to argue that the game is not realistic, look no further than the lack of simultaneity of actions including movement and firing. |
That's a primary reason why I argue in favor of changing the RAW where appropriate. If a person could realistically move while firing a weapon, but the RAW does not allow it, then IMO the RAW should be altered to better fit "reality", in so far as it exists cinematically.
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Rerun941
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Joined: 27 Jul 2004
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Location: San Antonio, TX
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| Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 1:58 pm Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: | | Bren wrote: | | But if I was going to argue that the game is not realistic, look no further than the lack of simultaneity of actions including movement and firing. |
That's a primary reason why I argue in favor of changing the RAW where appropriate. If a person could realistically move while firing a weapon, but the RAW does not allow it, then IMO the RAW should be altered to better fit "reality", in so far as it exists cinematically. |
But the RAW DOES allow movement as well as an action. (2nd Ed R&E Rulebook page 101). Characters are allowed to move over Very Easy, Easy or Moderate terrain at up to half of their Move score as a free action during their turn. Humans have a default Move score of 10, so this amounts to being able to move 5m every turn for free.
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 2:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Rerun941 wrote: | | But the RAW DOES allow movement as well as an action. Characters are allowed to move up to half of their Move score as a free action during their turn. Humans have a default Move score of 10, so this amounts to being able to move 5m every turn for free. |
I was just going off what Bren said. I can't find the reference in the rulebook, but does the RAW specifically say that a character can't move more than half their Move while firing? I would think MAPs would be more appropriate here than a specific cut-off.
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Rerun941
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| Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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I edited while you were writing your reply. The text about movement is on page 101.
You can move more than half your Move score, but then it counts as an action and incurs MAPs. So if a player says "I want to move 15m and fire at the stormtrooper" that's 2 actions and -1D to both actions. But if he says "I want to move 4m and fire at the stormtrooper" it's only the shot and incurs no MAPs.
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ZzaphodD
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| Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: | | ZzaphodD wrote: | | Well no matter, my point stands. Firing two shots within 5 seconds is not more difficult than firing 1 every other five seconds. |
I must disagree with you here. Reducing the number of shots allows you to take your time and focus on your technique and take extra care when aiming. |
You dont gain anything from aiming more than 5 seconds.
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