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Random Numbers
Commander
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 Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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What if you just rolled for each shot?
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ZzaphodD
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| Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 2:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Random Numbers wrote: | | What if you just rolled for each shot? |
We did that in our last campaign (over a decade ago)...the problem is that then no one parries blaster shots and all Jedis goes for dodge.. We have to find a middle ground..
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garhkal
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| Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 4:36 am Post subject: |
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| ZzaphodD wrote: | | garhkal wrote: | | You may be able to parry blaster shots, but as a shotgun (and therefore decksweepers as well) scatter the shot around you you cannot deflect that! |
Still, if one assumes that parrying 1000 blaster shots fired simultaneously is within the realm of the possible, any arguments that a shotgun blast is impossible to parry falls rather flat. |
'By that messed up logic a jedi should also be able to deflect stun bolts, which are rings of energy.. BUT they cannot.
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Bren
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| Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 6:43 am Post subject: |
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Gharkal wrote:
| Quote: | ZzaphodD wrote:
| Quote: | garhkal wrote:
| Quote: | | You may be able to parry blaster shots, but as a shotgun (and therefore decksweepers as well) scatter the shot around you you cannot deflect that! |
Still, if one assumes that parrying 1000 blaster shots fired simultaneously is within the realm of the possible, any arguments that a shotgun blast is impossible to parry falls rather flat. |
'By that messed up logic a jedi should also be able to deflect stun bolts, which are rings of energy.. BUT they cannot. |
Gharkal - I'm curious, what's the source for this? I can't find it in SW R&E and don't recall it from the movies. |
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ZzaphodD
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| Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:30 am Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | ZzaphodD wrote: | | garhkal wrote: | | You may be able to parry blaster shots, but as a shotgun (and therefore decksweepers as well) scatter the shot around you you cannot deflect that! |
Still, if one assumes that parrying 1000 blaster shots fired simultaneously is within the realm of the possible, any arguments that a shotgun blast is impossible to parry falls rather flat. |
'By that messed up logic a jedi should also be able to deflect stun bolts, which are rings of energy.. BUT they cannot. |
Where is that stated?
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ZzaphodD
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| Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:38 am Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | ZzaphodD wrote: | | garhkal wrote: | | You may be able to parry blaster shots, but as a shotgun (and therefore decksweepers as well) scatter the shot around you you cannot deflect that! |
Still, if one assumes that parrying 1000 blaster shots fired simultaneously is within the realm of the possible, any arguments that a shotgun blast is impossible to parry falls rather flat. |
'By that messed up logic a jedi should also be able to deflect stun bolts, which are rings of energy.. BUT they cannot. |
But I agree that the logic behind parrying an unlimited amount of attacks is messed up though.. 
But, as I said, Im working on adding some limitation to this. One idea might be that for each 'blaster parry' action you can parry a number of attacks equal to your Sense skill. 4D sense = Each parry is good for 4 attacks. Another idea would be to have each attack after the first incurs a penalty to the parry roll, for example -2. This is 'realistic' as it means you will 'easily' parry the first shots but after a while you might have problems with keeping up with the incoming fire. Drawback: each attack will have a different for hitting meaning more book keeping.
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Bren
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| Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 8:08 am Post subject: |
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ZzaphodD wrote:
| Quote: | | But, as I said, Im working on adding some limitation to this. One idea might be that for each 'blaster parry' action you can parry a number of attacks equal to your Sense skill. 4D sense = Each parry is good for 4 attacks. Another idea would be to have each attack after the first incurs a penalty to the parry roll, for example -2. This is 'realistic' as it means you will 'easily' parry the first shots but after a while you might have problems with keeping up with the incoming fire. Drawback: each attack will have a different for hitting meaning more book keeping. |
I like this ZzaphodD,  but I might also be tempted to use combined actions (perhaps with a lesser effect for no command roll) to increase the chance to hit. Someone, might even of been you,  on one of the threads suggested using a power of 2 system to increase chance to hit. Do ~ 1000 shots aimed at a character would be 2^10 so +10D to chance to hit. <parry that Jedi!>. I like this cause it applies equally to dodge or LS parry.
Though I suppose you could also use your mechanic for other avoidance skills, e.g. Dodge of 6D allows your reaction dodge to affect up to six attacks without MA penalty, similarly for melee parry (though functionally there will be a physical limit to the number of attackers that can try to it someone in melee). |
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ZzaphodD
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| Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Bren wrote: | ZzaphodD wrote:
| Quote: | | But, as I said, Im working on adding some limitation to this. One idea might be that for each 'blaster parry' action you can parry a number of attacks equal to your Sense skill. 4D sense = Each parry is good for 4 attacks. Another idea would be to have each attack after the first incurs a penalty to the parry roll, for example -2. This is 'realistic' as it means you will 'easily' parry the first shots but after a while you might have problems with keeping up with the incoming fire. Drawback: each attack will have a different for hitting meaning more book keeping. |
I like this ZzaphodD, but I might also be tempted to use combined actions (perhaps with a lesser effect for no command roll) to increase the chance to hit. Someone, might even of been you, on one of the threads suggested using a power of 2 system to increase chance to hit. Do ~ 1000 shots aimed at a character would be 2^10 so +10D to chance to hit. <parry that Jedi!>. I like this cause it applies equally to dodge or LS parry.
Though I suppose you could also use your mechanic for other avoidance skills, e.g. Dodge of 6D allows your reaction dodge to affect up to six attacks without MA penalty, similarly for melee parry (though functionally there will be a physical limit to the number of attackers that can try to it someone in melee). |
Nah, that mechanic is a bit too math heavy to come from me.
I also dont want to apply the same logic to Dodge, as in that case you are not actually dodging each separate attack as you see it coming, as is the case in blocking blaster fire or melee attacks. Instead you are making yourself difficult to hit in general. This can be dodging for, or using, cover. It could aslo mean dodging and weaving in the open, which I usually call 'jumping around like a monkey on fire'. If SW wouldnt be a game about heroics, that would probably incur a penalty of some sorts. If 1000 stormtroopers are shooting at you, without combining, someone will hit just because of chance (wild die).
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Bren
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| Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 3:27 pm Post subject: |
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ZzaphodD wrote:
| Quote: | Nah, that mechanic is a bit too math heavy to come from me.
I also dont want to apply the same logic to Dodge, as in that case you are not actually dodging each separate attack as you see it coming, as is the case in blocking blaster fire or melee attacks. Instead you are making yourself difficult to hit in general. This can be dodging for, or using, cover. It could aslo mean dodging and weaving in the open, which I usually call 'jumping around like a monkey on fire'. If SW wouldnt be a game about heroics, that would probably incur a penalty of some sorts. If 1000 stormtroopers are shooting at you, without combining, someone will hit just because of chance (wild die). |
Mostly agree on the math. I find my enthusiasm for math heavy systems is waning as I age. Of course I also doon't want to roll 1000x4D attacks either.  I do like the simplicity of your mechanic though. I am not really comfortable with the idea that a Jedi can make it harder for 20, 50, or 100+ opponents to hit him just by waving his lightsaber around really fast. I don't really mind if a whole crowd of stormies don't hit the heroes, but I do want the heroes to be afraid that they will be hit. In other words, they should be dodging away from the stormies or waving their lightsaber as they run for cover, not dodging or waving and advancing on the Imperials. I think your system manages that pretty well and has the virtue of being pretty simple.
I think it works OK and I might be inclinded to use it in some situations for dodge as well, for example how easy is it to dodge a firing squad. According to the rules, execution by firing squad vs. the PCs would almost always fail.
In a combat situation, in the Clone Wars cartoons the Clones seem to act as blaster soaks for the Jedi, so that the total number of shots aimed near the Jedi is not too many for them to handle, since the droids are dividing their fire amongst the Clone troopers as well. But if enough Clones are shot before the Jedi can close on the enemy, the Jedi tend to either retreat or do the amazing jump thing to immediately close. |
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ZzaphodD
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| Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 4:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Bren wrote: | I think it works OK and I might be inclinded to use it in some situations for dodge as well, for example how easy is it to dodge a firing squad. According to the rules, execution by firing squad vs. the PCs would almost always fail.
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The problem here is really how you handle the 'monkey on fire' thing. If you are ok with PCs more or less dodging on the spot right in the open (or against a wall in your example) then go ahead. In your example I would rule that the PC may make a dodge as usual, but would end up on the ground as he/she makes a desperate dive to keep his skin water proof. The next round he would start on the ground, not a good position to keep dodging.
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garhkal
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| Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 5:00 am Post subject: |
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| ZzaphodD wrote: | | garhkal wrote: | | ZzaphodD wrote: | | garhkal wrote: | | You may be able to parry blaster shots, but as a shotgun (and therefore decksweepers as well) scatter the shot around you you cannot deflect that! |
Still, if one assumes that parrying 1000 blaster shots fired simultaneously is within the realm of the possible, any arguments that a shotgun blast is impossible to parry falls rather flat. |
'By that messed up logic a jedi should also be able to deflect stun bolts, which are rings of energy.. BUT they cannot. |
Where is that stated? |
In many novels we see jedi being taken down by opponents shooting on stun, since they cannot deflect the shot (darksaber is the one that crops to mind, but iirc Attack of the clones and revenge of the sith also mentioned it).
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Bren
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| Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:05 am Post subject: |
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gharkal wrote:
| Quote: | | In many novels we see jedi being taken down by opponents shooting on stun, since they cannot deflect the shot (darksaber is the one that crops to mind, but iirc Attack of the clones and revenge of the sith also mentioned it). |
Thanks gharkal, good to know where this came from. Seems like the droids should just have their blasters all set on stun. Did Palps engineer a no stun setting just to keep the war going longer.
So is that what Resist Stun is far?
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Resist Stun
Control Difficulty: Moderate
Time to Use: One minute
Effect: Resist stun allows the Jedi to prepare his body to resist the effects if stun damage. The power must be activated before the character has suffered any damage. A successful result allows the Jedi to resist all stun results (except for unconscious). An unconscious result forces the Jedi to drop the power and he is considered stunned. Normal injuries (wounded, incapacitated, mortally wounded, and killed) are treated normally.
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Well not exactly, the power seems to kind-of ignore stun attacks and only discuss below wounded stun results from regular attacks. Hmmm...while it helps a little, not a stun-proof defense. |
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garhkal
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| Posted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 5:25 am Post subject: |
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Yup. Jedi knew they could not block stun shots, so made Resist stun to compensate.
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