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What Star Wars novels have you read? Liked?
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2016 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am a huge old schooler when it comes to SW novels. These are the ones I would recommend to anyone:

- The Courtship of Princess Leia
- The Thrawn Trilogy
- Tales from the Mos Eisley Cantina
- Tales from Jabba's Palace
- Tales of the Bounty Hunters
- any of the 'Tales' series really; they expand the SWU significantly by not focusing on major characters (I hope they write one for Maz Kanata's castle from Episode VII)
- the earliest four or five books of the X-Wing series

Can't stand any of the new Jedi order, nor the Yuzan Vong (did I even spell it right? That's how much I care...). Not a fan of the Jedi Academy trilogy (how many underpowered, hyperemotional Jedi do we need? or superweapons for that matter?) or the Black Fleet Crisis. I stopped reading the Corellian trilogy 60% of the way through.

Once the SWU started to look a lot different than the one I was used to, I sort of lost interest. Basically right around the time Jacen and Jaina solo were nearing 20 I guess.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2016 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The most widely recommended books appear to me to be the Thrawn series and the X-wing series (Bantam – 1990s), which together consist of the following:

1991. Heir to the Empire – Zahn
1992. Dark Force Rising – Zahn
1993. The Last Command – Zahn
1996. Rogue Squadron – Stackpole
1996. Wedge's Gamble – Stackpole
1996. The Krytos Trap – Stackpole
1997. The Bacta War – Stackpole
1997. Specter of the Past – Zahn
1998. Wraith Squadron – Allston
1998. I, Jedi – Stackpole
1998. Iron Fist – Allston
1998. Vision of the Future – Zahn
1999. Solo Command – Allston
1999. Isard's Revenge – Stackpole
1999. Starfighters of Adumar – Allston

The first three Zahn books were great. Now I am on the fourth Stackpole novel, and, I have found them to be kind of a slog, honestly. Hoping it picks up after this point.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2016 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like Fate of the jedi and the Republic Commando books *dives for cover at mention of the latter*. i Also love Courtship of Princess Leia, I, Jedi , Allegiance and Choices of One (the Hand of Judgement Duology as it were).
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 6:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RedKnight wrote:
I like Fate of the jedi and the Republic Commando books *dives for cover at mention of the latter*. i Also love Courtship of Princess Leia, I, Jedi , Allegiance and Choices of One (the Hand of Judgement Duology as it were).


DOn't knock your liking of Courtship of leia.. I found it very enjoyable.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 4:12 am    Post subject: Catalyst by James Luceno Reply with quote

Last night I finished Catalyst, the prelude to Rogue One. The novel takes place from near the beginning of the Clone Wars to a couple years before the RO prologue. (Inside the book is an erroneous canon novel timeline that misplaces the novel as taking place much later than it actual does). The main characters are Galen Erso, Orson Krennic, and Lyra Erso. The story goes a long way to explain the history and relationship of these characters and the early growth of the Death Star Project. Jyn Erso is born during the Clone Wars and seen as a little kid by the end. Despite Tarkin's superior rank, the novel also goes into the rivalry between Tarkin and Krennic, showing how they plot against each other. As the book goes on another significant character is a Dressellian smuggler who introduces Saw Gerrera to the Ersos near the end (Saw himself is not in the book much). The story ends with the Ersos escaping the Empire and becoming farmers as seen in the RO prologue.

The best part about the book is that it helps explain why the first Death Star took so long to be completed. A working superlaser and a lot of other details of the battle station were not already designed when construction began. These were developed along the way. Another huge factor is that Galen Erso and a lot of the scientists working on the station would be morally opposed to the final product so they were lied to about what they were working on. The project was heavily compartmentalized with several different teams working on different aspects of the station independently from each other and spread out around the galaxy. Not many in the Empire even knew the full big picture of the project (I believe only Palpatine, Vader, Tarkin, Mas Amedda and Krennic knew.) All that with Galen Erso possibly delaying development of the first Death Star project as much as possible really explains how the second Death Star was fully armed and operational in a only a few year's time.

The novel does not contradict the films and I have no trouble adopting the continuity from it into my personal canon. However, there was very little action and the book was quite boring. For that reason it is my least favorite novel by my favorite Star Wars author.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RedKnight wrote:
I like Fate of the jedi and the Republic Commando books.


I actually really liked the first RC novel - but the second one I couldn't finish. I may go back to them at some point.

Right now I'm taking a break from my 007 reading marathon to try Lost Stars, which is surprisingly okay! I'm a bit of a snob about books and a lot of the SW novels are pretty rank to me. The ones I did like are the Brian Dailey Han Solo novels, the Zahn ones (but even those have a sliding scale), Shadows Of The Empire and some of the short stories from the SW Adventure Journals.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Reading I, Jedi and came across this passage:
Quote:
Jedi skills in the Force are rooted in three areas. Control is internal. It is the Jedi's ability to recognize the Force in himself and to use it to his benefit. Sense involves the next step, in which the Jedi recognizes the Force in the universe outside herself. Here she feels the Force and is able to draw upon it for information about the world around her. Through it she is connected to the rest of the universe. Alter is the third and most difficult area to master, for it involves the student's ability to modify the Force and redistribute its energies. Through these skills, the Jedi can influence the universe, making changes as needed to accomplish its goals.

The power known as Alter Mind bridges all these skill areas. Through it a Jedi can project her perception of reality into the mind of another, or an illusion or conclusion that she needs the other to hold as true. This is a most magnificent and useful power, but it is also one fraught with danger. Bending the will of another for a benign purpose can be noble and good. The dark side lurks nearby in this power, so it should be used with caution.

A paraphrase of the RPG rules! Cool It was great how the RPG established many of the "laws" of the SW universe, and the fiction which followed those laws worked really well. (Getting pulled out of hyperspace by an object's gravity well, for instance.)
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PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 5:43 am    Post subject: Re: What adult Star Wars novels have you read? Liked? Reply with quote

I thought I would re-post this updated version, and with some revisions to my commentary.

Darth Bane: Path of Destruction (good book, the anti-hero's epic villain quest, plausible set-up of Sith order seen in films)
Darth Plagueis (great book by James Luceno, shows the two Sith Masters before Sidious but Palpatine is actually the main character, novel details periods of his life from his teen years and into behind the scenes of TPM)
Cloak of Deception (good book by Luceno, prequel to TPM featuring Qui-Gon as main protagonist, answered about all my questions about TPM, explained trade federation, galactic politics and scandal around Valorum, Tarkin involved in plot a bit)
Darth Maul: Shadow Hunter (good book, action-packed and philosophical, picks up where Cloak of Darkness leaves off and leads directly into TPM)

The Phantom Menace

Rogue Planet (long boring middle growing living starships, Anakin kills in rage before AotC, if I had known this book was a pointless prequel-era tie-in to NJO I wouldn't have read it)
Outbound Flight (didn't like this prequel-era Zahn, a few film characters are not much more than cameos, Jorus C'Boath was way too much of a dill-hole before crossing over to the Dark Side to ever be a Jedi Master, future grand admiral Thrawn is the protagonist of this story)
The Approaching Storm (so boring, should be retitled When Animals Attack Jedi: The Approaching Drizzle)

Attack of the Clones

Yoda: Dark Rendezvous (ok but not that engaging, title is bait-and-switch - a couple of padawans are the main characters not Yoda, second and final confrontation of Yoda and Dooku is brief and disappointing just like the original one in AotC, Obi-Wan and Anakin only cameo)
Labyrinth of Evil (great book by Luceno, prologue to RotS deals with the Jedi hunt for Darth Sidious, explains Sifo-Dyas and how Dooku became Sith, action-packed final third of book is first half of the film's Battle of Coruscant; Mon Mothma, Bail Organa and Padme's part in battle shown. This is still my favorite Star Wars novel that I've read.)

Revenge of the Sith

Kenobi (some cool ideas but it was largely boring and I was overall disappointed with it)
Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader (great book by Luceno, worthy follow-up to RotS, Tarkin and Chewbacca involved in plot)
Catalyst: A Rogue One Novel (Backstory of Krennic, Galen, Lyra and Jyn. Helps explain why the first Death Star took so long to be built, but there was very little action and the book was quite boring.
Tarkin (decent)
The Paradise Snare (see Rebel Dawn below)
The Hutt Gambit (see Rebel Dawn below)
Lando Calrissian Adventures (3) (Been a long time since I read these but I remember enjoying them, maybe a little wacky)
Han Solo Adventures (3) (Been a long time since I read these original Han Solo Adventures but I remember enjoying them)
Rebel Dawn (I enjoyed this Han Solo Trilogy a lot except for the ridiculous EU portrayal of Boba Fett)

A New Hope

Allegiance (classic-era Zahn, the main protagonist is the ultra powerful teenage Imperial superhero Mara Sue Jade who even defeats Vader in a duel, the unbrainwashed renegade stormtroopers go AWOL the very first time they were ordered to do something immoral, the classic trinity are minor characters and completely absent from the climax. When will I stop reading Zahn?!)
Splinter of the Mind's Eye (meh, Leia can't swim but Luke from a desert planet can??, Luke and Leia's lightsaber skills amplified by a Force crystal as they fight Vader in an encounter rightfully ignored by TESB)

The Empire Strikes Back

Shadows of the Empire (great book, love how it connects a lot of the dots between TESB and RotJ, love the soundtrack too)

Return of the Jedi

The Truce at Bakura (ok but not a worthy follow-up to RotJ, entechment seems too non-SW)
Rogue Squadron (see below)
Wedge's Gamble (see below)
The Krytos Trap (see below)
The Bacta War (see below)
Wraith Squadron (I enjoyed these first five X-Wing novels. I have the rest but haven't read them yet.)
The Courtship of Princess Leia (Solo's bachelor party, entertaining until they get to Dathomir when it quickly goes downhill with primitive spellwork Force magic and sentient rancor steeds)
Heir to the Empire (loved it)
Dark Force Rising (loved it)
The Last Command (loved it all the way until the bait-and-switch climax in which the classic trinity is sidelined and the author's own Mara Sue Jade dramatically usurps them to become the galactic savior, which ruined the Thrawn Trilogy for me dramatically)
Jedi Academy Trilogy (just plain silly, Jedi baby saves Luke, super-weapon that destroys stars fits in a small ship, author's character crosses over to the Dark Side and returns but no one cares, I can't believe I read all three of these books but I did)
The Crystal Star (horrible, based on rejected Star Trek: DS9 script. The only novel that has inspired me to write a letter to the author.)
Corellian Trilogy (ok trilogy)

I also read about half of Children of the Jedi, Spectre of the Past and Aftermath before dropping them out of boredom.
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"Would you trade that necklace for a glimpse into your future? ...What do you know of kyber crystals?"

"The Force moves darkly near a creature that’s about to kill... I'm gonna follow Jyn. Her path is clear."

"Tell that to Kanjiklub."


Last edited by Whill on Sat May 20, 2017 4:55 am; edited 2 times in total
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Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
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PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 2:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Catalyst by James Luceno Reply with quote

Whill wrote:
Last night I finished Catalyst, the prelude to Rogue One....

(snip)

However, there was very little action and the book was quite boring. For that reason it is my least favorite novel by my favorite Star Wars author.



Oh, gods, you are correct about that. Boring is the word for it.

I felt that Luceno had a contract to fill and a short time to do it. We ended up with a thin story that, in a better developed book, would have been a side story--the "B" or "C" plot.

It's not that I didn't like the story. It's that there's not enough meat in that story to serve an entire novel. It should have been a short story, in a collection of short stories. Or, as I said, it should have been one of the side plots in a novel,where you follow the main plot, then cut away to see what is happening with that "B" story for a while, then cut back to the "A" story.



I was actually excited when I saw Luceno was writing the book, though. Luceno wrote Darth Plageius, which is a fantastic book. It is so good that it actually makes the Prequels better films. It enhances the overall prequel story arc.

I had high hopes for Cataclyst because of that book, and I was very disappointed.





I've been disappointed in all of the new Star Wars I've read. Bloodline was also quite boring. I thought Catalyst was better, if you can believe that. I barely finished Bloodline, but I seem to be in the minority. From the reviews, many really enjoy Bloodline.

Aftermath, I couldn't finish. It's the worst of the three new books I've attempted to read. Maybe one day I'll try to go back and finish it, but I've tried twice now. Both time, I put it down, not wanting to return.
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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2017 5:47 am    Post subject: Re: What adult Star Wars novels have you read? Liked? Reply with quote

Whill wrote:
Catalyst: A Rogue One Novel (Backstory of Krennic, Galen, Lyra and Jyn. Helps explain why the first Death Star took so long to be built, but there was very little action and the book was quite boring.
I just finished this today. Worse that simply boring. There is just no there, there.

Also after reading this book Galen Erso is actually stupider than he and his wife appeared to be in the movie.
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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2017 6:52 am    Post subject: Re: What adult Star Wars novels have you read? Liked? Reply with quote

Bren wrote:
Whill wrote:
Catalyst: A Rogue One Novel (Backstory of Krennic, Galen, Lyra and Jyn. Helps explain why the first Death Star took so long to be built, but there was very little action and the book was quite boring.
I just finished this today. Worse that simply boring. There is just no there, there.

Also after reading this book Galen Erso is actually stupider than he and his wife appeared to be in the movie.


Yeah, Lyra thinking that just shooting Krennic while there are four other armed men (all of them badass Death Troopers, no less!) standing around her would save her husband from being taken hostage was really stupid. Not to mention that she abandoned her own daughter to do it. Seriously, what kind of wife and mother orphans her own kid to make an obviously futile attempt to save her husband? Especially after rehearsing and preparing for the inevitable day when they would be found?

And how do we know that they prepared for that day?
Quote:
LYRA: Saw, it's happened. He's come for us.
SAW: You know what to do.

Not to mention that that hideaway hatch didn't just magically appear there. Rolling Eyes

I don't remember seeing the Too Dumb To Live trope on the Rogue One page, but I think Lyra's behavior qualifies.
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2017 3:40 pm    Post subject: Re: What adult Star Wars novels have you read? Liked? Reply with quote

Thanks to Whill for the formatting! Very Happy

Han Solo Adventures (3) I really dug these. I like how you could clearly see that there was no sense of a true, unified "EU" at this point, and how different the CSA feels. But still, lots of fun.


A New Hope

The Star Wars Trilogy An interesting read. Alan Dean Foster's ghost-written adaptation of ANH based on one of Lucas' scripts or screenplays (credited to Lucas) was interesting in terms of how different it was from the actual film. As I recall, the other two books tracked more closely to the films themselves.

The Empire Strikes Back

Shadows of the Empire I liked this one ok, but just never got that into the characters themselves.

Return of the Jedi

The Truce at Bakura Eh. It was alright. I don't remember a ton about it, other than lizards that smelled with nasal tongues or something, and a reasonably sympathetic Imperial commander. I liked that part, actually, broadening the Empire from just moustache-twirling villains into complicated characters.

Rogue Squadron (see below)
Wedge's Gamble (see below) I think I only read two of the X-wing series. I remember Stackpole's descriptions of stuff in the books happening, and me thinking "That's not how it played out in X-wing..." Like, fighters tended to dodge torpedoes, but I remember Stackpole describing an X-wing locking a torpedo onto a regular TIE. I gather there were a ton of books in this series.

The Courtship of Princess Leia This was kinda disappointing, as I recall. I wasn't in love with the concept of the Nightsisters, riding freakin' rancors, and I didn't like Leia being played like an actual medieval princess as some pawn in a marriage alliance.

Heir to the Empire
Dark Force Rising
The Last Command The Thrawn Trilogy, to me, is probably the best novel series I read in terms of capturing the "feel" of Star Wars. I know it's all "Legends" continuity now, but it's still a d*mn fun series, even if it doesn't stand up to continuity.

Jedi Academy Trilogy I read these and thought they were...eh. I didn't like the notion of another superweapon being the macguffin. I thought the use of some force powers was just flat-out dumb, and I thought the depiction of Kyp Durron as this fallen Jedi who eventually reformed was also dumb. Plus, Wedge dated a bird. WTF?

Children of the Jedi I don't remember much about this one, other than it being kinda dumb and Luke ending up dating a ghost who later became a robot or something.

Darksaber Another stupid superweapon, as I recall. And Luke's Robot/Ghost girlfriend peaces out. No love for you, Luke.

The Crystal Star I remember reading this and not liking it, but I can't remember why.

Corellian Trilogy I dimly recall this one, and found it mediocre. Han Solo's cousin (who, basically, looks like Harrison Ford with a beard) was in it. The Solo kids are annoying. Meh.

Black Fleet Crisis Trilogy This was the point where I was really losing interest in the Star Wars novels. They seemed to basically rotate three overall plots: a new superweapon threatens the galaxy, some ersatz-Empire threatens the galaxy, or a dark Jedi threatens the galaxy. Mix and match as you please. Moreover, the novels lacked the "feel" that the original Thrawn trilogy had. Even going back and re-reading the Thrawn trilogy, I would still enjoy it, but pretty much everything after lacked that same feel, and came with diminishing enjoyment. It was at this point that it occurred to me that maybe the stories of the original trilogy heroes should just come to a close with a "And they lived happily ever after" and we should all just move on.

The New Rebellion This was the last Star Wars novel I read, and I found it intensely boring. Mostly because it dealt with a crazy Jedi, a bunch of "political intrigue" (which was more tedious than intriguing), and I think Mon Mothma got really sick in this one or something. I dunno. I can't even remember.

I stepped off the Star Wars novel train at this point, and never went back. Still haven't, really. When they killed Chewie off in a later book just to make it "edgy" and then had the new "big bads" be, basically, what sounded like a biological version of the Borg, I knew I wasn't going back.

Most of this stuff is why I took the attitude that the EU was basically anywhere from garbage to mediocre at best, with only the Thrawn Trilogy as a true stand-out. I was perfectly happy when Disney chucked the whole thing out, and even happier when I saw Disney continue to turn to the WEG sourcebooks for background material (because you don't throw the baby out with the bathwater).

I sometimes wonder if Zahn's having used the WEG materials in the creation of his tale was a BIG part of why his first trilogy felt like such a great expansion of the Star Wars universe. I wonder how much later authors referred back to them...
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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2017 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
It was at this point that it occurred to me that maybe the stories of the original trilogy heroes should just come to a close with a "And they lived happily ever after" and we should all just move on.


Amen. Basically why Tolkien threw out his notes for a Lord Of The Rings sequel series.
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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2017 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WillTasker wrote:
Quote:
It was at this point that it occurred to me that maybe the stories of the original trilogy heroes should just come to a close with a "And they lived happily ever after" and we should all just move on.


Amen. Basically why Tolkien threw out his notes for a Lord Of The Rings sequel series.


I remember a reference to this in an article about TFA a year and a half ago. I had it bookmarked. Here's the link: http://www.salon.com/2015/12/24/from_a_new_hope_to_no_hope_at_all_star_wars_tolkien_and_the_sinister_and_depressing_reality_of_expanded_universes/
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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2017 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sutehp wrote:
WillTasker wrote:
Quote:
It was at this point that it occurred to me that maybe the stories of the original trilogy heroes should just come to a close with a "And they lived happily ever after" and we should all just move on.


Amen. Basically why Tolkien threw out his notes for a Lord Of The Rings sequel series.


I remember a reference to this in an article about TFA a year and a half ago. I had it bookmarked. Here's the link: http://www.salon.com/2015/12/24/from_a_new_hope_to_no_hope_at_all_star_wars_tolkien_and_the_sinister_and_depressing_reality_of_expanded_universes/


Really interesting piece, but essentially true.

I always thought that any sequel to the OT should be set several hundred years in the future, after many years of peace and prosperity. Basically, the OT heroes get to live happily ever after, but the galaxy goes through the same cycles. Only this time, it'd be a civil war WITHIN the reestablished Jedi order.
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