The Rancor Pit Forum Index
Welcome to The Rancor Pit forums!

The Rancor Pit Forum Index
FAQ   ::   Search   ::   Memberlist   ::   Usergroups   ::   Register   ::   Profile   ::   Log in to check your private messages   ::   Log in

The Force Awakens (original spoilers thread)
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The Rancor Pit Forum Index -> General Star Wars -> The Force Awakens (original spoilers thread) Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 8, 9, 10 ... 12, 13, 14  Next
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Falconer
Commander
Commander


Joined: 08 Dec 2014
Posts: 315

PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I pondered the question of where exactly Luke’s sister came from, and came up with this variant theory. I mentioned before that Spaarti Cylinders (cloning technology) is one possible solution.

Luke’s blue lightsaber that he lost at Cloud City was found… and so was the severed hand that had gripped it. Rey is that hand. In a manner of speaking, ahem. The hand was used—by whom, we don’t know—to create a clone of Luke, modified to be a woman instead of a man—why, we don’t know. The clone possessed all the training that Luke had accumulated by the time that he lost his hand—such as expert piloting, and extensive Force abilities. When she is finally reunited with the lightsaber,



she instantly has a Force Vision—of Luke’s battle with Darth Vader at Cloud City.



Then she falls down as we hear Luke’s scream (from the scene in ESB when his hand is cut off). Then she sees this—zooming in on Luke’s prosthetic hand:



Alright, so, as everyone knows, she more or less goes through the whole of TFA recapping Luke’s SW+ESB adventures: flying with Han (and him even offering her a job), blowing up a Death Star, having a lightsaber battle with a Darth, warm fuzzies with Leia. Big obvious exception: no training. And the movie ends with a focus on a lightsaber… and a hand gripping it… and the meaning obviously not lost on Luke.



One more thing. Remember this trailer? It has that poignant voiceover, “The Force is strong in my family. My father has it, I have it, my sister has it. You have that power, too.” This, of course, is Luke speaking to Leia in RotJ. But in the trailer, as he says “my sister has it,” you see Maz Kanata handing the lightsaber to Rey (a shot from a deleted scene).

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)


Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10286
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy

PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting ideas, Falconer. And thanks for posting the screenshots!

Falconer wrote:
One more thing. Remember this trailer? It has that poignant voiceover, “The Force is strong in my family. My father has it, I have it, my sister has it. You have that power, too.” This, of course, is Luke speaking to Leia in RotJ. But in the trailer, as he says “my sister has it,” you see Maz Kanata handing the lightsaber to Rey (a shot from a deleted scene).


The problem here is that Maz is not handing the lightsaber to Rey. Maz is handing it Luke's actual sister, Leia. She is wearing her TFA Resistance general costume inspired by the ANH rebel soldiers. Notice the grey folded-up sleeve, the dark vest that hides the waistline and opens forward when an arm is reaching forward, and the hand that is not as slender as Daisy Ridley's hand. After the Battle of Takodana, Maz originally went to the Resistance base with Han, and the deleted scene with the shot in the trailer was Maz giving the lightsaber to Leia, Luke's sister as his voice-over in the trailer says. They decided that it just didn't seem right for Maz to go there just to give the lightsaber and then not go to the Starkiller or do anything else important, so they changed it to Maz giving the lightsaber to Finn and then staying on her own planet.

Falconer wrote:
she instantly has a Force Vision—of Luke’s battle with Darth Vader at Cloud City.



What I find most interesting about this image comparison is that in Rey's vision reconstruction of this TESB Cloud City shot, Rey is standing in Vader's place. That would actually make sense if Rey is the reincarnation of Anakin, as in one popular hypothesis. And, with reincarnation, she could still have any biological parents.
_________________
*
Site Map
Forum Guidelines
Registration/Log-In Help
The Rancor Pit Library
Star Wars D6 Damage
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Sovereign Protector


Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14023
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.

PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 1:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Falconer wrote:
Okay, so, I think Rey being Han & Leia’s daughter (and the villain’s sister) is the most convincing of the mainstream, obvious explanations, but, here’s something else to mull around.

How about Rey being Luke’s sister?


Isn'lt that Leia that is luke's sister?? So how would rey be one?
_________________
Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Falconer
Commander
Commander


Joined: 08 Dec 2014
Posts: 315

PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 2:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whill wrote:
The problem here is that Maz is not handing the lightsaber to Rey. Maz is handing it Luke's actual sister, Leia.

You may be right about that. Anyway, I don’t think they are going to remove Leia as Luke’s sister. It’s still interesting that the original quote is addressed to Leia but they re-cut it so it seemingly applies to Rey (“my sister has it” = Leia; “you have that power too” = Rey, but in RotJ Leia).

Whill wrote:
What I find most interesting about this image comparison is that in Rey's vision reconstruction of this TESB Cloud City shot, Rey is standing in Vader's place. That would actually make sense if Rey is the reincarnation of Anakin, as in one popular hypothesis. And, with reincarnation, she could still have any biological parents.

It actually doesn’t seem to me to be the same spot; I interpret it that she hears them down the hallway and begins to run towards them.

As for the reincarnation theory, I just don’t see it. It seems weird to me.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)


Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10286
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy

PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Falconer wrote:
I think Rey being Han & Leia’s daughter (and the villain’s sister) is the most convincing of the mainstream, obvious explanations

Maybe you are more active in discussing Rey's identity with Star Wars fans than I am, but I wouldn't think her being Ben Solo's sister would be the most mainstream explanation. So many hints throughout the whole film point to Luke being her father that I would think that would be the most convincing, mainstream and obvious explanation. I'm not saying she certainly is Luke's daughter, but if she's not, then it was all a huge red herring.

garhkal wrote:
Falconer wrote:
How about Rey being Luke’s sister?

Isn'lt that Leia that is luke's sister?? So how would rey be one?

He isn't saying Leia is not Luke's sister. He is saying that Rey might also be a sister to Luke.

Falconer wrote:
Whill wrote:
The problem here is that Maz is not handing the lightsaber to Rey. Maz is handing it Luke's actual sister, Leia.

You may be right about that.

Why Maz handing lightsaber to Leia cut from movie

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to imply that was my own speculation. The original source for this article is buried somewhere in a 32 minute video interview of JJ Abrams and Lawrence Kasdan but I didn't spend the time to find the exact part of the video. Anyway, even ignoring the visual evidence that I provided for Leia for the trailer clip, the story originally having Maz go to the Resistance base and handing over the Skywalker lightsaber to Leia is directly from JJ's mouth.

Falconer wrote:
It’s still interesting that the original quote is addressed to Leia but they re-cut it so it seemingly applies to Rey (“my sister has it” = Leia; “you have that power too” = Rey, but in RotJ Leia).

I agree that in light of the full film, the "you have that power too" line from the trailer was referring to Rey, and it is another hint of Rey having some familial relationship with the Skywalkers. Interestingly, that trailer voice-over was not lifted from RotJ dialogue. Mark Hamill newly recorded that specifically for the trailer.

Falconer wrote:
As for the reincarnation theory, I just don’t see it. It seems weird to me.

Sure. The idea is an extension of the Force Ghost phenomena.

When living beings die in Star Wars, by default their individuality ceases to exist and their individual life Force merges with the general life Force. Becoming a Force Ghost is from the rare ability to maintain personal identity beyond physical death, a spiritual Force being whose life Force does not transform into the general Force. This already exists in Star Wars.

Reincarnation may be possible in Star Wars if Force Ghosts can re-inhabit a physical body, a new one that doesn't already have a personal identity (an unborn baby). That certainly is unprecedented for Star Wars, and I can understand why that may seem weird to people (especially if the concept of reincarnation in real life is alien to you). For me, Force Ghost reincarnation seems much more natural than some sci-fi explanation for Rey being the daughter of Anakin born 11 years after her father's death, or a genetically engineered sequentially hermaphroditic clone of Luke's severed hand. Those ideas are as equally unprecedented, yet much more "weird" to me.
_________________
*
Site Map
Forum Guidelines
Registration/Log-In Help
The Rancor Pit Library
Star Wars D6 Damage


Last edited by Whill on Sun Mar 26, 2017 5:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Sovereign Protector


Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14023
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.

PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
He isn't saying Leia is not Luke's sister. He is saying that Rey might also be a sister to Luke.


But how? Padme (the mother of Leia and luke) died just after their birth, as shown in Revenge of the Sith.. So how could they have another sister??
_________________
Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Falconer
Commander
Commander


Joined: 08 Dec 2014
Posts: 315

PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That question is what led me to the clone solution.

Of course, Timothy Zahn already came up with the idea in 1993’s The Last Command, of Luke’s blue lightsaber reappearing, wielded by a clone of Luke that they made from the genetic material of his severed hand. It wasn’t a girl, but, the concept of unaltered vs. modified clones was explored in Attack of the Clones.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)


Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10286
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy

PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Falconer wrote:
Timothy Zahn already came up with the idea in 1993’s The Last Command, of Luke’s blue lightsaber reappearing, wielded by a clone of Luke that they made from the genetic material of his severed hand. It wasn’t a girl, but, the concept of unaltered vs. modified clones was explored in Attack of the Clones.

True. When I said "unprecedented" I meant within film canon. I thought that was obvious because everyone knows about Mara Sue killing Luke's clone made from his severed hand. Reincarnation likewise exists in the EU, although it is not Zahn.

The film clone modification was for "growth acceleration," and to make them "more docile" and "less independent than the original host," so cloning from biomatter dead 11 years and altering the clone's gender would be taking "clone modification" to an unprecedented extreme.

But sure, Force Ghost reincarnation probably is more weird to most fans.
_________________
*
Site Map
Forum Guidelines
Registration/Log-In Help
The Rancor Pit Library
Star Wars D6 Damage
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Urban Spaceman
Lieutenant Commander
Lieutenant Commander


Joined: 13 Sep 2010
Posts: 194
Location: UK

PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 2:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

garhkal wrote:

But how? Padme (the mother of Leia and luke) died just after their birth, as shown in Revenge of the Sith.. So how could they have another sister??


Genetic data from Vader?

(I'm not supporting the theory, just throwing out a possible answer to the question)
_________________
"The ships hung in the sky in much the same way that bricks don't."
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
MrNexx
Rear Admiral
Rear Admiral


Joined: 25 Mar 2016
Posts: 2248
Location: San Antonio

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some interesting speculation about Rey's heritage on Dragonsfoot.

http://dragonsfoot.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1833635#p1833635
http://dragonsfoot.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1833637#p1833637

For those who don't want to head over there, the helmet that Rey wears on Jakku belonged to Captain Dosmit Reah of the Tierfon Yellow Aces (as described in the Visual Dictionary). Reah was a female X-wing pilot, and Rey's Survival Guide says that Rey made a doll of Reah, and she was something of a role model in her survival on Jakku.

Not only is this a neat connection to WEG (Tierfon Base being from the Sourcebook), but the similarities of the names are interesting.
_________________
"I've Seen Your Daily Routine. You Are Not Busy!"
“We're going to win this war, not by fighting what we hate, but saving what we love.”
http://rpgcrank.blogspot.com/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Sutehp
Commodore
Commodore


Joined: 01 Nov 2016
Posts: 1797
Location: Washington, DC (AKA Inside the Beltway)

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's actually spelled "Raeh." The Aurebesh letters on the helmet are Resh (R), Enth (ae), and Herf (h).

Yes, I taught myself to read Aurebesh. I can still only read it one letter at a time, but I can read it. Mr. Green
_________________
Sutehp's RPG Goodies
Only some of it is for D6 Star Wars.
Just repurchased the X-Wing and Tie Fighter flight sim games. I forgot how much I missed them.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
shootingwomprats
Rear Admiral
Rear Admiral


Joined: 11 Sep 2013
Posts: 2685
Location: Online

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ugh I so hate this idea but here it is. What is Snoke is a clone of Luke Skywalker, made from the hand he lost while fighting Darth Vader in Cloud City?

Keep in mind, the original opening shot of TFA would have had Luke's hand grasping his lightsaber as it floated through space above Jakku.
_________________
Don Diestler
Host, Shooting Womp Rats
The D6 Podcast
http://d6holocron.com/shootingwomprats
@swd6podcast, Twitter
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
WillTasker
Lieutenant Commander
Lieutenant Commander


Joined: 25 Jan 2017
Posts: 115

PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

shootingwomprats wrote:
Ugh I so hate this idea but here it is. What is Snoke is a clone of Luke Skywalker, made from the hand he lost while fighting Darth Vader in Cloud City?

Keep in mind, the original opening shot of TFA would have had Luke's hand grasping his lightsaber as it floated through space above Jakku.


I also hate this idea... which means its even more likely the direction Disney is going in. Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Sutehp
Commodore
Commodore


Joined: 01 Nov 2016
Posts: 1797
Location: Washington, DC (AKA Inside the Beltway)

PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2017 5:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WillTasker wrote:
shootingwomprats wrote:
Ugh I so hate this idea but here it is. What is Snoke is a clone of Luke Skywalker, made from the hand he lost while fighting Darth Vader in Cloud City?

Keep in mind, the original opening shot of TFA would have had Luke's hand grasping his lightsaber as it floated through space above Jakku.


I also hate this idea... which means its even more likely the direction Disney is going in. Laughing


That raises the question of who cloned Luke and why. Any halfway decent writer would have had to answer that question ahead of time.

And yes, I know we're talking about Disney here, so please note that addendum I made about "halfway decent". The question of whether Disney has or hired "halfway decent writers" for its continuance of the Star Wars franchise is one that I shall leave to the ages.

And yes, I whole-heartedly agree that Snoke being a clone of Luke Skywalker is a terrible, terrible idea. In fact, that idea is just as terrible as how terrible K-2SO is at being a spy. Razz
_________________
Sutehp's RPG Goodies
Only some of it is for D6 Star Wars.
Just repurchased the X-Wing and Tie Fighter flight sim games. I forgot how much I missed them.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Wajeb Deb Kaadeb
Commodore
Commodore


Joined: 07 Apr 2017
Posts: 1448

PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 9:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, what's the line here on R2-D2? Why did he "wake up" at the most dramatic point? Why didn't he perk up the first time BB-8 was around, before the attack on Starkiller base?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The Rancor Pit Forum Index -> General Star Wars All times are GMT - 4 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 8, 9, 10 ... 12, 13, 14  Next
Page 9 of 14

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group


v2.0