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Resolving the Lancer / Tartan Confusion
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 12:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 'torpedo' frigate seems a little light on the # of torpedo launchers.. If anything i could see dropping the # of lasers and turbos down by 2 each and increasing it to 8 launchers.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 1:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

garhkal wrote:
The 'torpedo' frigate seems a little light on the # of torpedo launchers.. If anything i could see dropping the # of lasers and turbos down by 2 each and increasing it to 8 launchers.

The reason it's light is because those are basically Capital Scale torpedoes, inflicting 9D damage a piece, at the same scale as an ISD (7D+3D) or an MC80 (6D + 3D). With 8 launchers, you're looking at a +2D-3D bonus to damage (depending on which coordination method you use), which would turn this ship into a star destroyer killing space munchkin. I kept the number of launchers low for two reasons: 1) it forces these relatively tiny ships to use cooperative tactics against larger ships, and 2) I picture these torpedoes as quite large, massing as much as a large speeder or small starfighter.

A better fix would be to shorten the range, forcing the ship to come much deeper into the target's threat envelope before firing.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 1:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ForbinProject wrote:
Love the Soldier-Series Light Frigates, but just for clarification in Star Wars what makes a ship a pinnace or a "light" shuttle?

I hadn't really put a lot of thought into it. Mostly, I just wanted to make clear that most of these can't carry fighters, just light duty shuttles.

Quote:
Ship classifications seem to be based on length/size.

Yes, but size is not the full measure, but rather an indicator of other capabilities, such as power plant size, endurance (consumables stowage) and weapon throw weight.
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Amazing. Everything you just said was wrong.
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ForbinProject
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 4:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
garhkal wrote:
The 'torpedo' frigate seems a little light on the # of torpedo launchers.. If anything i could see dropping the # of lasers and turbos down by 2 each and increasing it to 8 launchers.

The reason it's light is because those are basically Capital Scale torpedoes, inflicting 9D damage a piece, at the same scale as an ISD (7D+3D) or an MC80 (6D + 3D). With 8 launchers, you're looking at a +2D-3D bonus to damage (depending on which coordination method you use), which would turn this ship into a star destroyer killing space munchkin. I kept the number of launchers low for two reasons: 1) it forces these relatively tiny ships to use cooperative tactics against larger ships, and 2) I picture these torpedoes as quite large, massing as much as a large speeder or small starfighter.

A better fix would be to shorten the range, forcing the ship to come much deeper into the target's threat envelope before firing.


You're referring to tactics developed by torpedo destroyers and PT-Boats. Those ships were the fastest and most maneuverable in a fleet.

The Bayonet Cruiser with it's better speed and maneuverability would be a better hull to convert to a torpedo boat if you dropped some of the energy weapons for some heavy torpedoes.
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ForbinProject
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 4:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
ForbinProject wrote:
Love the Soldier-Series Light Frigates, but just for clarification in Star Wars what makes a ship a pinnace or a "light" shuttle?

I hadn't really put a lot of thought into it. Mostly, I just wanted to make clear that most of these can't carry fighters, just light duty shuttles.

Quote:
Ship classifications seem to be based on length/size.

Yes, but size is not the full measure, but rather an indicator of other capabilities, such as power plant size, endurance (consumables stowage) and weapon throw weight.


From what I've been able to find pinnaces are supposed to be short range craft slightly larger than fighters that can conduct both combat and supply roles. A military version of a light freighter/transport.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 12:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ForbinProject wrote:
You're referring to tactics developed by torpedo destroyers and PT-Boats. Those ships were the fastest and most maneuverable in a fleet.

The Bayonet Cruiser with it's better speed and maneuverability would be a better hull to convert to a torpedo boat if you dropped some of the energy weapons for some heavy torpedoes.

That would be more appropriate for a different topic, since the Bayonet isn't really a part of the Lancer / Tartan confusion.

This is actually more of a copy of the Cobra-Class Destroyer from Warhammer 40,000, which were themselves a combination of destroyer and PT boat.

If I'm going to cut the ranges in the torpedoes, too, I suppose I could chop a D of power from the Shields and shunt it to the drives to make the Cataphract a Space 7 or 8 platform...
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ForbinProject wrote:
From what I've been able to find pinnaces are supposed to be short range craft slightly larger than fighters that can conduct both combat and supply roles. A military version of a light freighter/transport.

Historically, a Pinnace was a small craft assigned to support a naval vessel in a variety of roles. In the SWU, pinnaces were used by slavers to attack the Millennium Falcon in Han Solo's Revenge.

In the SWU, I picture a Pinnace being equipped with a dual blaster cannon, a tractor beam and a plasma torch, along with capacity for 6 or so passengers. This would allow the Pinnace to act as a picket, search & rescue vehicle, forced boarding platform and light passenger transport.

As far as other small craft, based on historical usage, I'd say a gig is configured as a sublight VIP passenger transport, while a launch or barge is configured as a larger personnel or cargo hauler. These designations would be distinct from hyperspace-capable shuttles and transports, and strictly for support of capital ship's and space operations.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
Amazing. Everything you just said was wrong.
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 2:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Made some changes to the Cataphract to reflect some issues.

-Boosted Space to 8.

-Reduced the range on the Torpedo Launchers.

-Reduced the Shields to 1D to compensate for the additional speed.

-Added a special rule allowing the ship to shunt power from the Maneuvering system to the bow shields. This would be primarily used when making an attack run (can't dodge while lining up the shot).
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
Amazing. Everything you just said was wrong.
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Sutehp
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ForbinProject wrote:
Love the Soldier-Series Light Frigates, but just for clarification in Star Wars what makes a ship a pinnace or a "light" shuttle?

Ship classifications seem to be based on length/size.


Yeah, a pinnace is "a small boat, with sails or oars, forming part of the equipment of a warship or other large vessel," according to Dictionary.com. This is the first time I've ever seen this word used as a Star Wars reference before, though.

(And no, I didn't read Han Solo's Revenge although, I suppose I should read the Han Solo Trilogy sometime. I can't wait to see the Han Solo Anthology movie if for nothing else to see the actual Sabaac game where Han wins the Millennium Falcon from Lando....)

And yeah, I copied down the D6 stats for the Soldier variants too. This is some great work, CRM.
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denderan marajain
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 3:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

garhkal wrote:
The 'torpedo' frigate seems a little light on the # of torpedo launchers.. If anything i could see dropping the # of lasers and turbos down by 2 each and increasing it to 8 launchers.


4 Launchers front do 12D Damage Fire-Linked. This is a lot
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CRMcNeill
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 4:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

denderan marajain wrote:
garhkal wrote:
The 'torpedo' frigate seems a little light on the # of torpedo launchers.. If anything i could see dropping the # of lasers and turbos down by 2 each and increasing it to 8 launchers.


4 Launchers front do 12D Damage Fire-Linked. This is a lot

No Coordination bonus system I'm aware of awards a +3D bonus for firing 4 linked weapons, let alone only 2.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
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denderan marajain
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 5:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CRMcNeill wrote:
denderan marajain wrote:
garhkal wrote:
The 'torpedo' frigate seems a little light on the # of torpedo launchers.. If anything i could see dropping the # of lasers and turbos down by 2 each and increasing it to 8 launchers.


4 Launchers front do 12D Damage Fire-Linked. This is a lot

No Coordination bonus system I'm aware of awards a +3D bonus for firing 4 linked weapons, let alone only 2.


sorry but i have no idea what you are talking about??

Source?

I only know the Fire-Linked "Rule"

Damage = Damage of the weapon +( Number of linked Weapons - 1)

For example

Laser Cannon with 3D
Quad = 6D


And i almost forgot the Command Rules but Coordination System Bonus is a term i have never heard of


Please enlighten me Smile
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Raven Redstar
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 6:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think denderan is referring to the fire linking rules from Tramp Freighters, which got unceremoniously ripped from the 1st Edition version of the book and regurgitated in the 2nd Edition without taking into account the coordination rules of the time; in 2E 4 things coordinated only equates to +2D bonus.

Several people use the quad cannons from the Falcon in the main book as the baseline, instead of assuming (as I normally do) that the quad cannons could be modified with increased damage rating.
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denderan marajain
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 6:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raven Redstar wrote:
I think denderan is referring to the fire linking rules from Tramp Freighters, which got unceremoniously ripped from the 1st Edition version of the book and regurgitated in the 2nd Edition without taking into account the coordination rules of the time; in 2E 4 things coordinated only equates to +2D bonus.

Several people use the quad cannons from the Falcon in the main book as the baseline, instead of assuming (as I normally do) that the quad cannons could be modified with increased damage rating.


These are News to me Wink
I can not find this Rule in de 2nd Edition Rulebook

But nevertheless 11D ist also a massive amount of Damage Wink
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Then just make it those launchers can't be firelinked. UNLESS firing at a static target (say shield generator or planetary base)...
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