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ZzaphodD
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 Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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Please..
Star Wars, not Quote Wars 
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
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Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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LMAO. Fair enough. Personally, I think hyperspace is badly underused in the SWU. I've played around with a few ideas to use it as something more than just a medium to travel from A to B. The idea that I really want to play around with is the hyperspace equivalent of a WWII night fighter, which can track other ships in hyperspace and either shoot them down or dock with and board them. This is just another idea.
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Fallon Kell
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| Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 7:03 pm Post subject: |
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I've always thought that even though points in hyperspace were coterminous with realspace, actually encountering anything in hyperspace while in hyperspace yourself is incredibly rare, and not the kind of thing you can do on purpose.
Ships that can attack others while in hyperspace might require extra special experimental techno mumbo jumbo that usually doesn't work...
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
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| Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 7:25 pm Post subject: |
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Hey, I never said it would be easy, but the potential is there. Soliton Wave Detectors are mentioned in the Black Fleet Crisis, which allow a ship to track another in hyperspace. The rest of it is just inserting the appropriate tech.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
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KageRyu
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Joined: 06 Jul 2005
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Location: Lost in the cracks
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| Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 12:21 am Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: |
If you read the description in detail, you will find that a ship can pass through a hyperspace pulsemass field completely unharmed if it stays in realspace. The pulsemasses only take effect if the ship either A) passes through the field while in hyperspace, or B) jumps to hyperspace while inside the field. |
And since the satelite you theorize would be in hyperspace, the pulsmass generator would destroy it - so why you think I need to "go and read it again" as you say several times in this post is beyond me. Perhaps you not only need to read the descriptions more carefully but need to read my posts more carefully.
| Quote: | | Furthermore, a Hyperspace Pulsemass Generator is only in the experimental stages as of TESB, and makes no more than a handful of appearances in the EU. |
As is the HOS, existing solely in the ISB to my knowledge. So how this is even relevent is again beyond me. Since you are using the fact that something is experimental to condem a strategy to use it against something else that is experimental.
| Quote: | | You need to read a little more in detail |
No I do not, and I am really being sick of being told I essentially don't know what I am talking about and to sod off and read better when you clearly are picking and choosing what aspects of what is written to apply or dismiss yourself. A very rude, heavy handed, one sided approach. For Example...
| Quote: | | As Fallon mentioned earlier, hyperdrives have a cut-out switch that is triggered by a gravity or mass detector. It is not that gravity itself forces the ship out of hyperspace; the gravity field is an indicator of a large mass in close proximity. Upon detection, the hyperdrive cut-out drops the ship back into realspace to avoid an imminent collision. |
This was speculative and I did concur that to an extent I agreed there is a safety switch - however SWU does not specificly say it is just a safety switch or whether the Gravity Itself does interfere as well. Official Sources seem to indicate it's more than a safety switch only, otherwise I am shocked that in all of the SWOU and EU material there has never been any mention of any smuggler or pirate performing a modification or hack to the HD to allow them to disable the ship to escape imperial blockades. Perhaps such a modification is too dangerous, perhaps it is impossible - but this is getting into to speculation on a vast level, as has been done thoughout this discussion, most often with arguments being used toward statements I make or suggest.
Also in example..
| Quote: | | If a hyperdrive were designed without a cut-out, or even with one with a different cut-out threshhold, it would not be forced out of hyperspace by a gravity field. |
So now your satelites hyperdrive does not have a safety switch and ignores gravity wells - something never before mentioned, but used in specific context to dismiss something from official sources I listed as counter to it and to imply I do not know what I am talking about.
| Quote: | | And also decreases effectiveness. Any soldier will tell you that making something more complex actually means that you are adding one more thing that will break down at exactly the wrong moment. |
And this isn't true of this jury-rigged, hyperspace-with-no-safety, in-permanent-orbit-around-a-planet-yet-imune-to-the-planets-hyperspace-shadow-and-mass-according-to-discription-by-some-miracle-of-fluff-writing satelite exactly how? The whole thing is far more complex and prone to issue, as well as hard to deploy, and more expensive than anything I have suggested, and gets more ludicrous and implausible with added capabilities and modifications not only to fluff and game rules but alterations to the real life principles of GPS (which you love to keep throwing an inaccurate and simplified version of in my face to say my suggestions wouldn't be feasible) as this discussion continues. You keep making notes like this to anything and everything I suggest - and it is clear to me, you are not doing it so much for the sake of a good discussion, but just to shoot them down and try to cling to the satelite idea, and belittle me and my suggestions
| Quote: | | Any number? As far as I am aware, there is only one intentional way to destroy a ship in hyperspace (the pulsemass generator), and even that is in the experimental stages as of the OT. |
In the official RPG and EU material there were other methods presented. Even in a post in this thread you acknowledge the mention of scanners used to track ships in hyperspace. While the Star Wars sourcebook does say there is no way to Detect Ships or objects in Hyperspace, the EU and OU have grown vastly since it's writing and it has not been amended, and still is only accurate to the first three movies, and some source material based on conceptual ideas and designs not officially used. There are later RPG books that contradict much of what was said in various chapters of the sourcebook, so it is not a do all end all source. I carefully cghose the examples to defeat the hyperspace satelit and show it to be anything but untouchable from official sources for a reason (and the Interdictor appears many places in OU and EU not just RPG). Still this is not good enough, and you fanagle eviegle and obfuscate information to try to wriggle into a situation where my material or information appears wrong when it is not.
Again, tired of this, and it is clearly you who need to go read it again, and filter the appropriate portions that are changed drasticly by the design alterations you made.
| Quote: | | The capsule states that it can take hours to locate the HOS, and that is with prior knowledge of where the HOS is located. |
It does so by searching possible triangulations of the satelite - something that while it may be nearly impossible with the HOS because of the fact it's a closed system, is made excessively easy by a Hyperspace GPS broadcasting a trackable signal that essentially says where it is. Wouldn't even need a PDV to do the search, just tune to the GPS transmission and bingo you have the locations of the satelites and can happily kill them at will. Just nudge an asteroid into it's orbital path, no need for a Hyperspace Pulsemass generator - when it hits that asteroid it's done (oh wait, I forgot somehow it became immune to the hyperspace mass ahdow and real mass of objects too - despite the rules on Hyperspace being very clear on this).
| Quote: | | Granted, an active comm signal will make the satellite easier to detect than the HOS, but there are ways around that as well: |
Of course their are, and the minute I bring up anything offical or speculative that involves it, you will tack something on and then tell me it's a problem in my suggestion, I don't know what I am talking about, and to sod off and read the books better. I get it now.
No, not wrong, that description I gave of the workings of the HOS was taken DIRECTLY from the Imperial Sourcebook - I physicly had it in front of my as I typed that - perhaps you need to go re-read the HOS writup.
| Quote: | | It doesn't need to. Modern GPS satellites do nothing more than broadcast a signal that boils down to a highly accurate clock. |
This is an extreme oversimplification. GPS is much more than that. In fact, altghough we use satelites in the Real World to operate GPS, it relies on trilateration with fixed reference points, and does not even require satelites - especially in a world as rich in alternate technology as Star Wars (and I believe this was pointed out by me earlier and shot down) I am not going to try to get into this, perhaps this might be useful:
http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/gadgets/travel/gps.htm
No matter how you slice it though a GPS device needs to be able to recieve a signal from a satelite, annaylyze that to determine distance (a fact which by placing the satelite in hyperspace than arguing against all detection and tracking have argued yourself into a corner on) with more than one satelite (so now we are talking dozens of these hyperspace satelites all in orbit at superluminal speeds, with no safety cutoffs, no way to avoid collisions, traveling so fast as to complete and orbit before it started - thus defying the laws of physics and not only gauranteeing they will collide with each other but with themselves as for GPS to work the satelites must have overlapping paths...and the beat goes on). I have chosen this real world snippit very carefully toillustrate the largher wholes in your theory since you love to use eferences that are not entirely applicable to "in the real world" to brow beat my suggestions. This directly applies.
| Quote: | | Again, wrong. It mentions a prototype, but then mentions it being put into production as well. |
Again, not wrong - it mentions "1 prototype being put into production" which is vastly different. While it does mention the device being used to steal data from hundreads of thousands of planets , it never says any more than one was built. Granted, it implies more than one by the large number of worlds data is stolen from, and talking about placement of more satelites, but never actually says it was put into wide production (I am looking at it right now). For all intents and purposes, they may be using the PDV to pick up the one scanner and move it from place to place.
| Quote: | | Your description as nonsensical fluff seems based on your unique interpretation of hyperspace. |
No, it has to do with direct contradiction of official rules and materials as presented in the Star Wars Universe and RPg, which I have cited & referrenced, some of which you yourself have cited (no actual refference provided though). It is nonsensical stuff. A brief Recap:
• The satelite is "lost" in the hyperspace mass shadow of the planet making it hard to find - colliding with the mass shadow of anything in Hyperspace will destry or criple a target craft (direct contradiction of material and my biggest sticking point since this began).
• It reads data by reading the hyperspace shadows left by streaking particle inside the computer and comparing...do I really need to finish this and address it? It is complete nonsense that flies against everything established for the level and sensitivity of hyperspace sensors...still you will want a finish so - if sensors can not distinguish between the mass shadow of a satelite and a planet, then how are they able to come up with the sensors capacity suddenly to not only make such a fine distinction, but to distinguish between the hyperspace shadows of a planet and not only the computer on it, but the hyperspace shadows left by sub-atomic particles moving through said computers circuits? It is complete nonsensical fluff and one of the reasons I never liked the HOS.
| Quote: | | Your assertion that the satellite would be knocked out of hyperspace ignores the official reason as to why it would be knocked out of hyperspace in the first place. |
Again, no it does not, and it is you who really needs to go and read up more on Hyperspace, gravity wells, interdictors, mass shadows, even just int the Star Wars Universe.
In short, You initially asked for ideas and suggestions, and then when I provided them took offense and jumped on me. You demanded I provide alternatives, and official citations, and I have for much of it, and you still dismiss anything that disagree with your point out of hand. You then demanded I "Don't just say it doesn't work, tell me whay and provide some alternatives" I believe the word you used was "Step Up" and I did, and you have continued to be somewhat rude and condescending. Being vague and indeterminate when explaining away reasons my ideas aren't feasible (even though not only do many of those explain aways not hold up, but also apply to your initial idea) while insisting I do not know what I am talking about. In my last post I carefull chose everything from Official sources to the RPG to point to very specific issues and contradictions with some of your posts - and now you are trying to dismiss those out of hand by either changing the rules or situation they apply to after the fact, or simply basicly doing "Nuh uh cause I said so".
You clearly never wanted actually Ideas or suggestions, and clearly have an axe to grind for some reason. I am sorry I ever tried to help or add anything constructive to your thread. Do not worry, it is not a mistake I will make again.
Do as you wish in your world but seriously read and get a better understanding of the material before repeatedly using that line on someone who has read it repeatedly, and played it for over 30 years.
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Last edited by KageRyu on Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:09 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Fallon Kell
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Location: Tacoma, WA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 4:27 am Post subject: |
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| KageRyu wrote: | | This was speculative and I did concur that to an extent I agreed there is a safety switch - however SWU does not specificly say it is just a safety switch or whether the Gravity Itself does interfere as well. Official Sources seem to indicate it's more than a safety switch only, otherwise I am shocked that in all of the SWOU and EU material there has never been any mention of any smuggler or pirate performing a modification or hack to the HD to allow them to disable the ship to escape imperial blockades. Perhaps such a modification is too dangerous, perhaps it is impossible - but this is getting into to speculation on a vast level, as has been done thoughout this discussion, most often with arguments being used toward statements I make or suggest. |
The fact that catastrophic collisions between craft in hyperspace and mass shadows of planets can happen suggests that the gravity well itself doesn't cause a hyperdrive to shut down. The fact that these incidents do cataclysmic damage to a world and can completely destroy lesser civilizations suggests that any modification to these safety systems is flagrantly and mortally illegal. It's also possible that the tolerances of these gravity well safeties are so close to the lethal range that modifications provide no practical benefit without massive risk of suicide...
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KageRyu
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| Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:17 am Post subject: |
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| Fallon Kell wrote: | | The fact that catastrophic collisions between craft in hyperspace and mass shadows of planets can happen suggests that the gravity well itself doesn't cause a hyperdrive to shut down. The fact that these incidents do cataclysmic damage to a world and can completely destroy lesser civilizations suggests that any modification to these safety systems is flagrantly and mortally illegal. It's also possible that the tolerances of these gravity well safeties are so close to the lethal range that modifications provide no practical benefit without massive risk of suicide... |
As I already said, however, there is No official source that says this is the case (if there is, book and page please). There is plenty of official sources that say that the Gravity Wells will knock a vessel out of hyperspace - in fact the official write ups for the interdictor in every D6 books it's in specifically says it's the Gravity Wells and not a safety cutoff switch on the vessel being targetted.
| Imperial Sourcebook, Page 56 wrote: | | The gravity well generators work on a simple principle, when focused it sends out waves of energy that disrupt mass lines in space, thereby simulating the pressence of a stellar body such as an asteroid or planetoid. The presence of so much massprevents ships in the area from engaging their hyperdrives, and it also drops ships already in hyperspace back in to normal space. |
This is offical to the D6 RPG, the Star Wars Universe, and the Expanded Universe. This is described in numerous books that feature the Interdictor, and very clearly says it is in fact the gravity mass that interferes and disrupts mass lines in space. I am not making it up, nor speculating in any way, and it is not "my interpretation" as has been suggested, it's verbatim.
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Fallon Kell
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| Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 1:51 pm Post subject: |
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I'm just pointing out that it's uncertain. The gravity wells could prevent ships from entering hyperspace by tripping safeties that look for disrupted mass lines. The Woookieepedia article on hyperspace supports this overall hypothesis, and it cites Galaxy of Intrigue in the section on hazards.
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
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Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:15 pm Post subject: |
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| KageRyu wrote: | You clearly never wanted actually Ideas or suggestions, and clearly have an axe to grind for some reason. I am sorry I ever tried to help or add anything constructive to your thread. Do not worry, it is not a mistake I will make again.
Do as you wish in your world but seriously read and get a better understanding of the material before repeatedly using that line on someone who has read it repeatedly, and played it for over 30 years. |
An axe to grind? Hardly. I was defending an idea I came up with, which is my right. You, on the other hand, seem to be the one emotionally invested in proving my idea wrong. Your behavior is a stark contrast to the much more mature approach of, say, ZzaphodD, who said his piece (that he didn't like the idea, and it probably wouldn't show up in his campaign), then let it be. Also, I'm genuinely impressed that you have been playing this game for over 30 years when WEG only started publishing it 25 years ago.
As far as reading and getting a better understanding of the material? I'm still waiting on you to provide examples of worlds that experienced environmental catastrophe due to ships jumping to hyperspace in too close proximity, or to provide a list of the other "tried and true ways of destroying a ship in hyperspace". Since some key points of your argument are based on these potentially apocryphal statements, it is incumbent on you to provide verification and references if you wish for your argument to be accepted as valid.
I should also point out your impressive ability to gloss over inconvenient facts when they don't support your argument. Specifically, you argued that the description of the HOS only mentioned one prototype, yet ignored the following quote: "With this device, the Hyperspace Orbiting Scanner (HOS), Imperial Intelligence has been able to tap into the computer networks on more than 470,000 worlds, and the number is increasing every day." Quite a lot of work for a single prototype satellite, but more believable if the device actually went into production, with thousands of units deployed all over the galaxy.
For my part, I did some research on the hyperspace cut-out, since your latest argument addressed it. The earliest mention I could find is as a mishap option on the hyperspace jump tables in the SW-RPG core rulebook, and it has been an official part of the canon ever since. The Wikipedia article on hyperdrives specifically mentions cut-outs as a safety device used to keep a vessel from running into uncharted objects, and states that Interdictor cruisers are specifically designed to take advantage of this automated fail-safe. The description of hyperdrives in the Star Wars Sourcebook (pages 6-7) does mention that hyperdrives can be adversely affected by a gravity field, but at no point have I ever suggested otherwise. The optional rule I posted above even takes into account increasing hyperspace jump difficulty the closer a vessel is to a gravity well.
When I post concepts to this forum, I already have it established in my mind that the basic concept functions in my SWU. I am looking for ways to improve it or iron out things I may have missed, not abandon the concept entirely just because it doesn't fit with someone else's opinion of how Star Wars should be. You say you were trying to be constructive, yet I fail to see how "Your idea doesn't work because that's not how I say the Star Wars Universe functions" qualifies as constructive. While I have gleaned some interesting ideas from this discussion, I mostly came away with the impression that you were trying to shove your concept of hyperspace (a concept that runs contrary to the official rules, as established by WEG, of the universe you have supposedly been gaming in for 30+ years) down my throat. You will excuse me if I take offense to that.
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KageRyu
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| Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:05 pm Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: |
An axe to grind? Hardly. I was defending an idea I came up with, which is my right. You, on the other hand, seem to be the one emotionally invested in proving my idea wrong. Your behavior is a stark contrast to the much more mature approach of, say, ZzaphodD, who said his piece (that he didn't like the idea, and it probably wouldn't show up in his campaign), then let it be. Also, I'm genuinely impressed that you have been playing this game for over 30 years when WEG only started publishing it 25 years ago. |
Excuse me!
your behavior is hardly mature - it has been continually patronizing, rude, and insulting from right after my first post. You asked for ideas - then jumped down my throat for providing them - then demand I "Step Up" and justify them - and regardless of what official sources I have directly quoted you continue to state that I do not know what I am talking about and how I need to re-read the rules even when I have quoted them verbatim! Not only is this not the actions of someone just defending an idea, it is the actions of someone looking for a whipping boy. You clearly are not as mature as you seem to think, nor do you have the grasp of the rules you seem to think. You are the one who said "Step up" and "Don't start an argument if you can't go the distance" and despite my repeated efforts to try to overlook slights and rephrase stastements and provide alternative ideas to avoid an argument you have continued to twist the content of rules and amend the situational aspects of your idea to countermand everything I have said - when much of your counter-arguments also invalidate your own point of view. Also, you might want to check again, Star Wars was not the first D6 based game from WEG.
*Edit Added*: Yes, you are almost right, the first D6 Star Wars was published in 1987 - 25 years ago, it debuted in 1986 at conventions as playable promo adventures still unfinished - oh what a sinister and evil person I am for making such an Agriegous mistake when it was so very long ago... been playing Ghostbuster's (where D6 started) since it promo'd at cons in 1985, and Star Wars since 1986, purchased the first printing, first edition of all the SW-RPG core, Sourcebook, ISB, RASB when they first hit the shelves - so my overall point of just how long I have played this game and how much exposure I have still stands. Oh how dare I be off by 3 whole years - must be sinister intent! Another example of manipulating what is a minor error on your part to make it the focus and an obvious attempt at deception.
| Quote: | | or to provide a list of the other "tried and true ways of destroying a ship in hyperspace". |
Already provided. Go back and reread the post where you then contradicted the material that was official and suggested I had it wrong dsespite it's verbatim descriptions.
| Quote: | | Since some key points of your argument are based on these potentially apocryphal statements, it is incumbent on you to provide verification and references if you wish for your argument to be accepted as valid. |
Potentially Apocryphal statements? I have pointed directly to the Book and Page number in all 3 printings of the rulebooks in previous posts that support my statments about how Hyperspace works in Star Wars. I have pointed directly to the pages in the imperial sourcebook for not only the Interdictor, but the Hypspace Pulsmass Generator, as well as the HOS and the segments of it's entry that are problematic. I have yet to see you post s single refference with a book and page to support it - and I am the one using apocryphal and unsupported arguments? Please, grow up.
| Quote: | | I should also point out your impressive ability to gloss over inconvenient facts when they don't support your argument. Specifically, you argued that the description of the HOS only mentioned one prototype, yet ignored the following quote: "With this device, the Hyperspace Orbiting Scanner (HOS), Imperial Intelligence has been able to tap into the computer networks on more than 470,000 worlds, and the number is increasing every day." Quite a lot of work for a single prototype satellite, but more believable if the device actually went into production, with thousands of units deployed all over the galaxy. |
I should point out not only your complete ineptitude at reading comprehension, but the fact that you claim I omit material I specificly addressed (really go read my post again I address this passage directly). You are to one omitting and glossing over material. In fact in no less than three earlier posts you atributed statements to me I never made as bad positions of an arguments (which is great and all except they were never part of my argument) - and this is exactly what I have grown irritated at.
| Quote: | | For my part, I did some research on the hyperspace cut-out, since your latest argument addressed it. The earliest mention I could find is as a mishap option on the hyperspace jump tables in the SW-RPG core rulebook, and it has been an official part of the canon ever since. The Wikipedia article on hyperdrives specifically mentions cut-outs as a safety device used to keep a vessel from running into uncharted objects, and states that Interdictor cruisers are specifically designed to take advantage of this automated fail-safe. |
And none of that adresses what I ask for - go read the verbatim and highlighted post of the RAW for the interdictor. I asked for 1 valid, official link that says gravity fields themselves do not interfere with Hyperdrives and it is only due tot he cutout - because that is not how every printing of the interdictor, in the numerous books for the RPG it is in, read.
| Quote: | | but at no point have I ever suggested otherwise. |
In fact you DID - in your last post - the one that set me off. You directly, in response to my statement about "tried and true methods of dealing with ships in Hyperspace" made such a claim regarding my mention of the interdicted, said I was wrong, and told me I should re-read it - when in fact I am 100% correct (and you still claim I haven't provided any supporting information for dealing with ships in hyperspace, as if you chose to simply ignore the two I did).
| Quote: | | When I post concepts to this forum, I already have it established in my mind that the basic concept functions in my SWU. I am looking for ways to improve it or iron out things I may have missed, not abandon the concept entirely just because it doesn't fit with someone else's opinion of how Star Wars should be. |
That's all fine, well and do - but let me point out the problems with your entire thought process in this thread and the attitude you have had to me:
• Your first post asked for ideas about GPS and Satelites in Star Wars. While you mention the HOS, you did not specificly state that was the only thing you wanted thoughts on. I made a lengthy post with lots of ideas about handling GPS, satelites, and satelite warfare in a space faring civization. I then stated, and made it CLEAR is was MY OPINION that I did not like the HOS, that I never liked it, and why. I was immediately rudely attacked.
• You then said you wanted alternative ideas, demanded I cite references, demanded I step up and provide alternate ways to "make and idea work not just shoot it down" even though I never shot it down and said more than once that was My feelings on the HOS and do what you want in your universe.
• Since you made it obvious you felt I did not know what I was talking about, I provided direct references to the rulebooks and pages that supported my stance on the nature of Hyperspace in Star Wars - directly conflicted with aspects of the HOS, and moved on to present additional ideas and materials in good faith... and you attacked again, with retorts that continually contained the phrase "wrong" "misread" "Go Read it again" and "In reallife it works this way"
• As this continued I posted links to real life information on GPS so you can see it's not as simple as you make it sound, and it can and does work using some of the methods I provided. I met a statement about how in Hyperspace your satelite was invincible while all of my suggestions were easily dealt with - knowing this to be wrong as in Star wars they deal with pesky hyperspace vessels a great deal - with reference to materials taken from the One Sourcebook the HOS is in that specificly deal with hyperspace - one of which has been a staple of Star Wars since the begining. And was attacked again, told I was wrong, had information I presented glossed over, twisted, or just ignored, and told to go read the books again.
Enough is enough - your conduct has been childish throughout this. Every suggestion I made was attacked, every reference I posted was either ignored, or dismissed with an incorrect out-of-hand assesment of it or an attempt to use aspects of it NOT RELEVENT to the situation and thus having no bearing to somehow say that that was why it wouldn't work. You have put words in my mouth on more than one occasion. You have ignored words I have posted on more than one occasion.
I even stepped back once - redacted an entire post - said I thing there is a breakdown in communication let's try again - and you continued to attack, attack, attack! Now you say I am the one being immature? Please.
It's one thing to defend an Idea - at any point you could have simply said - "Well, I'm still going to do it this way - so any ideas on how to improve it along THESE guidelines"
Instead you took the stance where you wanted to make it look as if I am unknowledgable and incompetant, and have no basis of rules or material to support my claims - so Of course I made it personal and defended myself - what did you expect?
In short, if you are not prepared for a differing opinion don't ask. If you can not cite references yourself, don't demand them from others. If you take any contrary idea or critique personally and attack - don't be surprised when others do as well.
| Quote: | | You say you were trying to be constructive, yet I fail to see how "Your idea doesn't work because that's not how I say the Star Wars Universe functions" qualifies as constructive. |
Again, lovely, putting words inmy mouth - and completely ignoring all of the pages of ideas I have submitted to try to be constructive - especuially when at one point you demanded I provide alternative ideasif I had a problem with the HOS - what a set up. I am done with you. You are a troll. Good day sir.
| Quote: | | I mostly came away with the impression that you were trying to shove your concept of hyperspace (a concept that runs contrary to the official rules, as established by WEG, |
Very incorrect - it is EXACTLY based on what's written in the WEG Star Wars Rulebooks, all three editions, and I have previously summarized as well as refferenced the pages in all three printings for reference that support this - I find THIS kind of response offensive and it's all I have gotten since my first post!
| Quote: | | You will excuse me if I take offense to that. |
No I will not - especially since you are the one who has gone out of your way to make rude and offensive posts from the start.
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"There's a set way to gain new Force Points and it represents a very nice system, where you're rewarded for heroism, not for being a poor conductor to electricity." ~Jachra
Last edited by KageRyu on Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:51 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16178
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:12 pm Post subject: |
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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jmanski
Arbiter-General (Moderator)
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 2065
Location: Kansas
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| Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:28 pm Post subject: |
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Ok, children... perhaps this should be tabled for now?
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Blasted rules. Why can't they just be perfect? |
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